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Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, world's best test 6/7/8 right now?

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Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, world's best test 6/7/8 right now? Empty Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, world's best test 6/7/8 right now?

Post by whitburn Fri 17 Aug 2018, 18:57

That's a mighty 6,7 and 8 for me. What says you?
Has there ever been a better 6-8?

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Post by taipan Fri 17 Aug 2018, 19:07

The SA 1st innings in this match wasn't too bad.
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Post by Growler Fri 17 Aug 2018, 19:14

There's certainly been a better Test No 7, whitburn.

Some fellow by the name of Gilchrist, I think .... and so the Australian lower middle order at the turn of the century was at least equal to these three IMO.
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Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, world's best test 6/7/8 right now? MPDozzd

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Post by whitburn Fri 17 Aug 2018, 19:41

Martyn, Gilchrist, Warne would that be? Decent trio.

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Post by beamer Fri 17 Aug 2018, 20:20

Warne was capable with the bat on his day, but averaged well below 20 over his career. Number 8 would be generous to him in this day and age.

It's the depth of England batting orders in recent times that has been impressive, Rashid will come in at 9 and he has 10 FC centuries to his name. He's been known to bat at jack in JAMODIs!

Just say we win this one then rest Jimmy for one of the last two Tests, we could have a lower order of Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, Curran, Rashid, Broad.

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Post by taipan Fri 17 Aug 2018, 20:47

Aye, it's a pity 1-5 is so shit.
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Post by beamer Fri 17 Aug 2018, 21:10

taipan wrote:Aye, it's a pity 1-5 is so shit.
Root and Bairstow are half decent...

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Post by Growler Fri 17 Aug 2018, 22:20

beamer wrote:Warne was capable with the bat on his day, but averaged well below 20 over his career. Number 8 would be generous to him in this day and age.

It's the depth of England batting orders in recent times that has been impressive, Rashid will come in at 9 and he has 10 FC centuries to his name. He's been known to bat at jack in JAMODIs!

Just say we win this one then rest Jimmy for one of the last two Tests, we could have a lower order of Stokes, Buttler, Woakes, Curran, Rashid, Broad.

Ah, beams - I don't disagree with a word you say here, but ...

... No 6 has often been our all-rounder position - Aus usually played a specialist batsman. When Gilly was at 7, they included Boof, Symonds, Clarke, S Waugh and Katich as well as Martyn. We had the bowling option (and wickets) ... they usually had the superior batsman.

No 7 - Gilly, as is self evident.

No 8 - is a bowlers spot. Runs are a bonus from there - and Chris Woakes was still picked as first change seamer, not a batsman 6th wicket down. A decent enough bowler - but undoubtedly a lower level than Warne.

Hence, playing in a team with a strong top order and 9-10-J, if you need both runs and wickets from 6-8 I think the Australians would fare better overall in a variety of conditions (excepr p'raps England on a green seamer Cool ).

Close, mind. Stokes, Buttler and Woakes are as good as any in recent years.
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Post by horace Fri 17 Aug 2018, 22:58

Of course the current Oz 6, 7, 8 is also the mighty Mere Marsh, Paine and Agar.
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Post by skully Fri 17 Aug 2018, 23:43

Laughing
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Post by beamer Sat 18 Aug 2018, 00:37

Nobody’s saying they wouldn’t take Warne as an all-round package, I mean you’d have picked him in his prime even if he batted like Chris Martin. But such bowlers are few and far between, and if you have good but not great bowlers you want them to have another string to their bow. Teams need to bat right the way down in this day and age, having numbers 7, 8 and even 9 who could make a century on a good day is a massive bonus. It’s like having an extra player or two, and gives a lot more flexibility to your selection.

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Post by whitburn Sat 18 Aug 2018, 08:03

Looking at all the test teams right now and listening to the experts saying it's a batsman's game, i'd say most world 1-5s are pretty poor. Look at the Indian 1-5 this series. Recent 1-5s in Australian losses abroad. The Pakistan 1-5 is often a shambles. NZ forever have been bailed out by 6-11. SA same. The current best team in the world can't deal with seam movement and swing. I'd say the game has moved over the years to a position where the gap between the top batters and 6/7/8 is smaller than ever. Jennings opening and Buttler at 7. How much better really is Jenno, if at all? is he really a better batter than Stokes?

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Post by beamer Sat 18 Aug 2018, 09:57

It’s become a requirement to bat deep, perhaps because of the decline of traditional Test batsmen with the patience and technique for all conditions.

Good openers have been in short supply for years, and there’s a lot of top orders that can be blown away quickly in unfamiliar conditions. If we still had old-style tails with a keeper averaging 20 at number 7 and four bowlers who barely know which end of the bat to hold, teams would be all out for less than 100 on a frequent basis. But fortunately aspiring bowlers (and keepers) these days know they need to be multi-dimensional cricketers.

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Post by taipan Sat 18 Aug 2018, 10:07

beamer wrote:It’s become a requirement to bat deep, perhaps because of the decline of traditional Test batsmen with the patience and technique for all conditions.

Good openers have been in short supply for years, and there’s a lot of top orders that can be blown away quickly in unfamiliar conditions. If we still had old-style tails with a keeper averaging 20 at number 7 and four bowlers who barely know which end of the bat to hold, teams would be all out for less than 100 on a frequent basis. But fortunately aspiring bowlers (and keepers) these days know they need to be multi-dimensional cricketers.

It is also dependent on the players you have available.SA batted genuinely deep for many years but the supply of genuine allrounders seems to have dried up. In the absence of real allrounders I still think it is preferable to pick specialists rather than bits and pieces players.
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Post by horace Sat 18 Aug 2018, 23:20

Agree with Taips. In the absence of proper all rounders (not Wattos, Marsh's and Agars), specialists should be chosen.

That said it is beholden on all specialist bowlers to work on their batting. Seeing players like Broad who can bat a bit, try and play the quicks from square leg or point is pretty shameful. Anderson might be a specialist number 11 but he gets behind the ball and has helped his team out.
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Post by Red Sun 19 Aug 2018, 10:14

How would the trio go on Asian dustbowls? Would they prove their mettle?
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Post by tricycle Sun 19 Aug 2018, 10:40

^I'm guessing no on the basis of their most recent performances in India, and that's honestly why tests suck these days. Every team's the same. Very good at home, horrible away.

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Post by Henry Wed 22 Aug 2018, 13:33

We may have the best lower middle order in the world, but that’s nullified by having the worst top five in the world.....
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Post by taipan Wed 22 Aug 2018, 13:39

taipan wrote:Aye, it's a pity 1-5 is so shit.
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Post by taipan Thu 30 Aug 2018, 07:15

Well that combination didn't last long.
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Post by Basil Tue 04 Sep 2018, 22:42

I don't think we celebrate our lower middle order enough. They are as good as it gets in terms of turning a match round. We prefer to be embarrassed by the paucity of our upper order.
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Post by Basil Thu 31 Jan 2019, 15:08

.


Last edited by Basil on Thu 31 Jan 2019, 15:09; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Wrong chuffing thread.)
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Post by taipan Thu 31 Jan 2019, 18:33

..
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Post by horace Thu 31 Jan 2019, 19:43

8/186 now with Foakes gawn. 

6,7,8 were not the worst today.
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