UK politics thread

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by lardbucket on Wed 17 Sep 2014, 22:36

Done and dusted?

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by beamer on Wed 17 Sep 2014, 22:44

Neil D wrote:Ah well.  Let's bear in mind that - Edinburgh and the Highlands aside - Scotland is a complete shi!thole.

No great loss.
Edinburgh and the Highlands is quite a large proportion of it though, the former in population terms and the latter in area... and the Commonwealth Games showed that Glasgow isn't quite how it's commonly perceived.

Sure, there's some shitty concrete commuter towns and run down former industrial areas but that's no different from England.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Wed 17 Sep 2014, 23:20

lardbucket wrote:Done and dusted?

Feels like it. Opinion polls have "No" at 51-52%, but all the momentum behind the "Yes" campaign. Latest Ipsos Mori poll has it 51:49, a 7 point gain for the Yeses, one day out from the vote.

The under 18s who wouldn't normally have a vote haven't appeared to have been factored into the professional pollsters' calculations either. They'll vote Yes heavily.

I'd be surprised if Scotland doesn't vote to split now. The Better Together campaign made the fatal error of appealing to their intellect by talking up facts and cold, hard reality, when what the Scots really want is vague hope and unicorns and anything that appears like a victory against the hated English.

"Team Scotland vs Team Westminster" was how the separatists framed it. Them against us. A predictable, lowbrow tactic (which is playing out quite predictably) which the absolutely incompetent clowns heading the unionists' pitch incredibly failed to see coming from a long way off.

The good news is, Cameron and Milliband will be finished as party leaders for their role in this debacle, which should at least make next year's general election somewhat interesting, contested by two new leaders and the UKIP racists.

What a time to be alive.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by beamer on Wed 17 Sep 2014, 23:45

They may need emergency legislation to cancel next year's election, otherwise the chances are there will be a Labour majority with the balance of power held by 50 or so Scottish MPs, who will have a year of voting on issues that would affect the remaining UK (we'd need a proper new name, South Britain? Greater England?) before they left and flipped it to a Tory government without so much as an election. So I expect we'll see an unprecedented six-year parliament if it's a Yes vote.

Anyway, what will Farage's plan to reclaim Scotland be?

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by JGK on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 00:44

Bookies are still pretty adamant that they will stay.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by Bradman on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 02:12

I think the polls (all polls) are skewed against younger voters. In terms of access more older people are likely to have a landline and be at home when the pollsters ring (don't know if it's done differently nowadays to account for this). This would seem particularly true in the case of u18s.

I think the result will follow the money.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by buckSH on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 06:05

When there were colonies to be looted, Scotland, Ireland & Wales hung around and there was no talk of independence then, now it seems as if the glue that binds together is no longer there.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 07:53

All over: Andy Murray's endorsed Yes.

To be fair, he's been losing a lot lately so has probably become used to being referred to as "Scottish tennis player, Andy Murray".
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by Big Dog on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 08:53

What percentage is needed for a win. In OZ you need 75% affirmative in referendums.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by taipan on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 08:57

Big Dog wrote:What percentage is needed for a win. In OZ you need 75% affirmative in referendums.

Straight majority.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 09:03

taipan wrote:
Big Dog wrote:What percentage is needed for a win. In OZ you need 75% affirmative in referendums.

Straight majority.

Although they're also letting the gays vote.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by taipan on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 09:08

Dello wrote:
taipan wrote:
Big Dog wrote:What percentage is needed for a win. In OZ you need 75% affirmative in referendums.

Straight majority.

Although they're also letting the gays vote.

That's the Union screwed then. all those sexual deviants running around in skirts.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by Brass Monkey on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 09:14

They aren't going anywhere. All these opinion polls are a bunch of dogshit. That's like taking The Sun polls as gospel. Hyperbolic. Get back to watching Eastenders, f*cktards.........
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by skully on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 09:33

The "No" vote will shit in.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 10:35

skully wrote:The "No" vote will shit in.

That's a reverse woof if ever there was one. Every man and his dog, outside the UK, is hoping for a Yes vote. Not because they're showing solidarity with the poor, oppressed Scots' heroic struggle, but because it's something interesting going on in the world. It's sticking it to the man. Smashing the system. And they're curious to see the fallout.

Don't pretend you're not rubbernecking like everyone else.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by skully on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 11:41

Don't be a haughty barsteward. Cool

Most outside the UK DGAF.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by Merlin on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 14:24

skully wrote:Don't be a haughty barsteward. Cool

Most outside the UK DGAF.

Most outside Scotland BUT INSIDE the UK don't now GAF !

Leave the jocks to f**k themselves - and frankly, I'm now hoping for a YES vote.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by buckSH on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 14:28

Dello wrote:Every man and his dog, outside the UK, is hoping for a Yes vote. Not because they're showing solidarity with the poor, oppressed Scots' heroic struggle, but because it's something interesting going on in the world. It's sticking it to the man.

Firstly, I don't think you are referring to people like me, because I have only cats. Then there are a lot of other issues here.

1. Firstly all the so-called 'statesmen' who were the first to weigh in on third-world and other issues drop their mask and get exposed for the trolls that they truly are. Niall Ferguson's article in the telegraph is a case in point. This lout used to dispense his advise quite freely on all other issues today comes across as partisan, fear mongerer and absolutely lacking in objectivity.

2. Andy Murray

3. Falklands. It's a scot name, isn't it. Does it get split between the scots and the rest of UK.

4. NZ is waiting to see the result, so that they can start to consider going the full republic route.

European undercurrents of seperatism are usually well hidden from the rest of the world. It is mainly due to good press management. Outsiders have little idea of what lies underneath the posh Euro-unity surface, while those folks pass pious judgements on 'self-determination' and 'freedom' to the 'oppressed' third world peoples. So for this group of 'oppressed peoples' this surely is a welcome spectacle and a change from being bombed the crap out of just so that they can get 'their freedoms'.


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Re: UK politics thread

Post by Brass Monkey on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 14:44

Willies
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 20:08

Bookies think it's nailed on for the NOs. 1/6 and shortening.

Weird. Seems to go against the perceived momentum.

No exit polls coming because everyone was too tight to pay for one. We'll only know when we know.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by beamer on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 20:14

The Yes side were always going to be more vocal and more visible, whether they were in the majority or not. When I was up there this summer the vast majority of posters etc. were for Yes but the people I actually spoke to tended to be Nos... recent reports have suggested people felt much less comfortable displaying No propaganda as they thought they might have their windows smashed etc.

I hope they do vote to save the UK but just hope the aftermath is peaceful and civilised whatever the result.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by LeFromage on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 20:27

Yeah, it feels like a lot of bridges are being burned, which could well lead to an awkward future whatever the outcome.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by beamer on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 21:09

The fact that they've been given a democratic vote surely has to be enough to prevent all but potentially a handful of idiots from trying to turn it into a new Northern Ireland.

The Westminster politicians need to learn from this as well, if it is a No (and in the case of a Yes, to still do so in terms of Wales, Northern Ireland, Cornwall, northern England, in fact everywhere outside London...) - that whoever is in power needs to govern for the benefit of the whole country, even if almost nobody in certain areas votes for them.

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Re: UK politics thread

Post by skully on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 21:29

Dello wrote:Bookies think it's nailed on for the NOs. 1/6 and shortening.

Weird. Seems to go against the perceived momentum.

No exit polls coming because everyone was too tight to pay for one. We'll only know when we know.

In the end, you don't get any more conservative than a wee Scot. "No" was always gonna prevail, IMHO.
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Re: UK politics thread

Post by beamer on Thu 18 Sep 2014, 21:33

Only conservative with a small "c"... the Tory sort don't get more than one man and his dog voting for them up there these days, even with a leader called Cameron...

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