Re: Aus Federal Politics thread (XV)

[horace]

Australia hasn't had 2 successive quarters of negative growth - the definition of a recession. Also at least one other of the 5 economic indicators (GDP, employment, retail sales, manufacturing, income) is not falling - employment.

Some economic wags have dreamed up some new marker called "per capita recession" (whatever the fark that is), which is what I guess you are pinning your Pinko hopes on.

Please continue reading Pinko ABC and loony Fox Money for your valuable economic news. That way you'll continue living in your commie fantasy land.

Geebers Skully. Fair enough and I hope you are right. Recession is not in any person's interest

Still I look at our economy and wonder what it's future is. We are good at digging up shit from the ground and then filling said holes with the detritus of consumerism.

The ability of nation states to influence their economies is limited. The UK BREXIT debacle is a negative example. The Rudd Keynsian spendathon inuring the Oz economy during the GFC was a positive example.

I think the current Fed Govt has missed some opportunities. The NBN has been less than a success. There is still no energy policy. Recent knee jerk initiatives like the hydro investments rely on coal playing a lesser role in power generation to be competitive. Our national governments (radishes as well) will continue to piss money on defence.

[skully]

Wait till Shortarse gets in power, then you'll really have something to worry about. When that chinless wonder Bowen becomes Treasurer, our economy will truly be farked up the arse.

I guess that's why I'm a little tetchy. I see that qunt needing to go on a desperate money grab (like the Vulture did) once they start going gangbusters with their social welfare crusades and green energy fantasies.

Self-funded retirees are the first to be hammered via some new tinkering with Super rules. I'm still trying to sort out a way around Shortarse's impending stealing of imputation credits on Share funds. Qunts.

And to blame the current Govt for the NBN debacle is laughable. It was your donkeys that dreamed up the scheme on the back of an envelop and left it in the lap of the good guys after Pinkos were banished again in 2013. The Libs have tried their best to continue funding the bottomless pit that the NBN was always going to be.

[skully]

Meanwhile, I see that bitter old qunt Turncoat has been on BBC saying the Libs dumped him because they feared he'd win the next election. Farkin PMSL, you deluded hick.

[horace]

Settle Skully. Shortpants is on the right of Truffles. I expect marginal change. My worry with the Manchurian candidate is a further lurch to the right in foreign affairs.

ScuMo might be a thick deluded religious nutjob but I expect he is less likely to engage in foreign wars than Shortpants.

I am less worried by self funded retirees losing some benefits than what future young people are facing. The future under ScuMo and Shortpants looks bleak to me.

[horace]

Geebers the Mad Monk is bloody funny. Last year he said we should withdraw from the Paris targets he signed up to. Last night in a debate with Steggall he said we should stick with them.

I guess the penny has dropped that people including Tories in his own electorate are worried about climate change. The wing nut never fails to deliver the poisoned chalice goods.

Skully is prolly right. The MM will hold his seat in a tight contest. Steggall is a formidable opponent for him. Last night she produced press clippings dating back to the 90s where the MM promised public transport upgrades. Of course he never delivered. Seems he has trotted out the same promise to his electorate for decades. Farkin' hilarious. The bloke could not lie straight in bed.

I do not like Steggall at all. But it seems she will strike a chord with Tories.

In the last election MM trundled around the country undermining Truffles and pretending he was a Napoleonic figure, waiting on a recall from exile. If nothing else ScuMo must be delighted MM is now caught up defending his seat. The MM is reviled around the country, inc by people who vote for the Tories. ScuMo must be relieved.

[skully]

No comment on the madder most recent ex-PM and his ridiculous BBC rant??

[Bradman]

Even Bolt admitted the existence of something called "per capita recession" (like you skulls I'm in blind deer country).

But that was when one of his normally tame economists talked about it and he became his fawning best.

[skully]

So that's when an individual is in recession, then???

My hair line may be receding a little but not sure I'm in economic recession.

[JGK]

So that's when an individual is in recession, then???

My hair line may be receding a little but not sure I'm in economic recession.

It means that the GDP per person has gone backwards for two quarters. The overall GDP has crept up because of immigration. As a measure of individual wealth and happiness - the per capita figure is more relevant.

[JGK]

I do not like Steggall at all. But it seems she will strike a chord with Tories.
.

What's wrong with Zali?

[JGK]

Self-funded retirees are the first to be hammered via some new tinkering with Super rules. I'm still trying to sort out a way around Shortarse's impending stealing of imputation credits on Share funds. Qunts.

.

Move the equity part of your SMSF into a cheap retail or industry fund which accepts pension phase money.

[Bradman]

Well I've got moocs to sell at record prices, but I think the majority may not think the good times are here. Apparently economic growth isn't keeping pace with population growth. At least the housing market looks only just slightly bloody silly but that should last only until the Reserve knocks down interest rates.

[skully]

the per capita figure is more relevant.

Can't say I've ever heard of it being referred to before.

Self-funded retirees are the first to be hammered via some new tinkering with Super rules. I'm still trying to sort out a way around Shortarse's impending stealing of imputation credits on Share funds. Qunts.

.

Move the equity part of your SMSF into a cheap retail or industry fund which accepts pension phase money.

Trouble is the Equity fund I'm in is a Aus Shares High Yield Dividend Fund and I rely on the income. The fund manager doesn't have an International Shares High Yield Dividend Fund. Do such funds exist?

I'm trying to avoid Shortarse's imputations credit theft.

[JGK]

Do you hold it through an SMSF?

IF so, if you can find an retail fund that offers it as part of their platform, you will continue to get the benefit of the franking.

[skully]

Yes, I hold it through my SMSF (I'm in Transition to Retirement).

Any particular fund that you'd recommend?

Can I pay your advisor fee in beers?

[JGK]

What's the fund you are in now?

[skully]

Vanguard Australian Shares High Yield Fund. It's a Wholesale Fund.

[JGK]

Vanguard Australian Shares High Yield Fund. It's a Wholesale Fund.

AMP's MyNorth Super Platform has it: https://www.amp.com.au/content/dam/product/mynorth/MyNorth-Investment-Options.pdf

Anyway, no need to stress now - wait until the proposed changes actually become law. There is a good chance it won't get through the Senate even if the hateful Pinko's get elected.

[skully]

Ha!! Cheers man. Most grateful.

[skully]

Out of interest, why would the Retail fund be not affected, yet the Wholesale fund is?

[JGK]

Out of interest, why would the Retail fund be not affected, yet the Wholesale fund is?

That's not the distinction (I think the AMP fund would be the wholesale fund). The issue is at the SMSF level - if you are in pension phase you won't have any other income in your SMSF (unless you have more than $1.6m in it). So if you have franking credits - there is nothing to offset it against and under the ALP rule you will lose the benefit of the credits because you can no longer get a refund for them.

However, if you hold the same investment through a large retail fund (or industry fund) the relevant taxpayer is no longer the SMSF, it is the retail fund. Retail funds have very large tax liabilities because of their accumulation stage money from other investors (which is taxed at 15%) and because contributions to it are also taxable. So if you are in pension phase in one of those funds, your franking credits can be used to offset the tax payable by the accumulation stage investors (because the fund itself is a single taxpayer). This is already done and generally the tax paying part of the super fund will pay dollar for dollar for the credits for the non-taxable part. Under the ALP rules as proposed, this will continue to be able to done. Hence the stupidity of the rules from a policy perspective (although they will be good for industry funds which of course donate to the ALP).

[skully]

Cool. Thanks again mate. I will hold fast and wait for a) the election result (inevitably a Pinko landslide) and b) the Senate vote.

[Big Dog]

Out of interest, why would the Retail fund be not affected, yet the Wholesale fund is?

That's not the distinction (I think the AMP fund would be the wholesale fund).   The issue is at the SMSF level - if you are in pension phase you won't have any other income in your SMSF (unless you have more than $1.6m in it).  So if you have franking credits - there is nothing to offset it against and under the ALP rule you will lose the benefit of the credits because you can no longer get a refund for them.

However, if you hold the same investment through a large retail fund (or industry fund) the relevant taxpayer is no longer the SMSF, it is the retail fund.  Retail funds have very large tax liabilities because of their accumulation stage money from other investors (which is taxed at 15%) and because contributions to it are also taxable.   So if you are in pension phase in one of those funds, your franking credits can be used to offset the tax payable by the accumulation stage investors (because the fund itself is a single taxpayer). This is already done and generally the tax paying part of the super fund will pay dollar for dollar for the credits for the non-taxable part.  Under the ALP rules as proposed, this will continue to be able to done.  Hence the stupidity of the rules from a policy perspective (although they will be good for industry funds which of course donate to the ALP).

You should be on the telly with stuff like that.

[horace]

Mr K is safe, but can his woofing impact international capital?

[Blackadder]

So the Bonkng Beetroot wants the Deputy PM position (while it lasts).
More disharmony on the Right, Two Months out from a Federal election.

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