McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
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The One
Hass
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McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
It's no secret that Warne and McGrath were the backbone of Australia's success, but how about this for a stat?
McGrath and Warne played their first Ashes test together in 1994.
Since then, Australia's Ashes record with McGrath and Warne reads:
25 matches, 19 wins, 3 losses, 3 draws.
In the same period, Australia's Ashes record without McGrath and/or Warne reads:
16 matches, 5 wins, 7 losses, 4 draws.
This doesn't tell us anything we didn't already know, but it is worth reinforcing the point, because those numbers are just amazing.
McGrath and Warne played their first Ashes test together in 1994.
Since then, Australia's Ashes record with McGrath and Warne reads:
25 matches, 19 wins, 3 losses, 3 draws.
In the same period, Australia's Ashes record without McGrath and/or Warne reads:
16 matches, 5 wins, 7 losses, 4 draws.
This doesn't tell us anything we didn't already know, but it is worth reinforcing the point, because those numbers are just amazing.
Hass- Number of posts : 2401
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
2/3 of those losses would be dead rubbers wouldnt they?
The One- Number of posts : 9035
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Australia didn't lose a home test when both the great men played after the MCG 1998 (even that was a fluke).
JGK- Number of posts : 41790
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Actually, I lie, Warne didn't play that match.
The last home game they lost was at Perth in 96/7 against the Windies.
The last home game they lost was at Perth in 96/7 against the Windies.
JGK- Number of posts : 41790
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
I appreciate the fact that they have retired, certainly!
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Here is z-score's take on the Champions:
http://www.sportstats.com.au/blognov06tomar07.html
5 January 2007
The New Invincibles
With McGrath and Warne, Australia has forgotten how to lose.
Over the past decade, Australia has occasionally looked beatable in the absence of either Glenn McGrath or Shane Warne. This is not a novel observation. Even so, looking at exact figures, it is astonishing to discover just how rarely Australia is beaten when both champions are available. Together, Warne and McGrath last tasted defeat in the March 2002 Test in Durban; since then the two great bowlers have shared a run of 35 unbeaten Tests. This extends to 47 Tests since their last loss in a “live” rubber, at Madras in 2001.
The figures for home Tests are just as remarkable. The last time Warne and McGrath played in the same losing side in Australia was in 1996/97 (a 10-wicket loss to the West Indies in Perth). Since then, Australia at home has been invincible with both bowlers on deck, winning 32 Tests, drawing six, losing none.
It’s not as though the firm of McGrath and Warne has not known defeat. There was the 2-1 loss in India in 2001, and a 2-2 draw in the West Indies in 1999. But as Australia’s batting strength has grown ever deeper in recent years, the losses have become rarer than ever. The overall figures showing Australia’s win/loss performance in the last five years is:
http://www.sportstats.com.au/blognov06tomar07.html
5 January 2007
The New Invincibles
With McGrath and Warne, Australia has forgotten how to lose.
Over the past decade, Australia has occasionally looked beatable in the absence of either Glenn McGrath or Shane Warne. This is not a novel observation. Even so, looking at exact figures, it is astonishing to discover just how rarely Australia is beaten when both champions are available. Together, Warne and McGrath last tasted defeat in the March 2002 Test in Durban; since then the two great bowlers have shared a run of 35 unbeaten Tests. This extends to 47 Tests since their last loss in a “live” rubber, at Madras in 2001.
The figures for home Tests are just as remarkable. The last time Warne and McGrath played in the same losing side in Australia was in 1996/97 (a 10-wicket loss to the West Indies in Perth). Since then, Australia at home has been invincible with both bowlers on deck, winning 32 Tests, drawing six, losing none.
It’s not as though the firm of McGrath and Warne has not known defeat. There was the 2-1 loss in India in 2001, and a 2-2 draw in the West Indies in 1999. But as Australia’s batting strength has grown ever deeper in recent years, the losses have become rarer than ever. The overall figures showing Australia’s win/loss performance in the last five years is:
Matches | Win | Loss | Draw | |
Both players in team | 40 | 33 | 1 | 6 |
With one or both missing | 25 | 17 | 6 | 2 |
England has never won a Test in Australia in which both Shane Warne and Glenn McGrath played.
The batting averages of Australia’s opponents show that the absence of either bowler has had an impact on Australia’s fortunes, and the effect is amplified when both are absent. Over the last 10 years, opponents’ averages have been:
With both players present (84 Tests): 25.9 runs per wicket.
With Warne absent (29 Tests): 29.0
With McGrath absent (25 Tests): 34.1
With both players absent (9 Tests): 39.0
The average with both absent rises to 42.7 if Tests against Zimbabwe are ignored. Such an average, although based on a small number of matches, is a cause for concern. It is similar to the average of West Indian bowlers in recent years; the West Indies have been managing only about one Test victory per year against serious opposition over the last five years.
McGrath and Warne will be missed; just how much remains to be seen. One good sign, for the team, is that neither bowler has been Australia’s best in the whitewash, that honour going to Stuart Clark. Australia’s batting will remain strong, so the worst case is probably that Australia will decline from near-invincibility to mere dominance.
The absence of any real challengers to Australia’s #1 position creates an environment different to the last mass retirement, that of Greg Chappell, Rod March, and Dennis Lillee in 1984. Lillee, in particular, was every bit as critical to his team’s success as Warne or McGrath, perhaps even more so. His career was marked by 31 wins to 16 losses; when he was absent, Australia’s fortunes were almost reversed, 14 wins and 21 losses, and the ratio is even more extreme if Tests just before and just after his career are included (15 wins, 32 losses).
The “Lillee effect”, however, was much stronger at home than away, because he played very few Tests on the subcontinent or in the Caribbean. By contrast, both Warne and McGrath have stronger records away than at home, so we might expect Australia to miss them more when on tour.
When Lillee and the others left the stage, the West Indies immediately took up the mantle of top team, thanks in part to a nightmare schedule where the new Australia played ten Tests in twelve months against them, a sequence that destroyed Kim Hughes’ career. The current Australians team, even without its retirees, has much less to fear.
JGK- Number of posts : 41790
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Add Gilchrist, to give TGM and tgm enough to bowl at when the top batting failed.
Guest- Guest
Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
JGK wrote:England has never won a Test in Australia in which both Shane Warne and Glenn McGrath played.
and only one in england (1997)
The One- Number of posts : 9035
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
The One wrote:2/3 of those losses would be dead rubbers wouldnt they?
Of the three losses with McGrath and Warne two were dead rubbers. Edgbaston 1997 was the only time the duo played together in a losing test with the series still alive.
Of the seven losses without McGrath and/or Warne five of them came when the series was still alive.
Hass- Number of posts : 2401
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
The One wrote:JGK wrote:England has never won a Test in Australia in which both Shane Warne and Glenn McGrath played.
and only one in england (1997)
England actually won three matches at home when playing against Warne and McGrath.
Edgbaston 1997
The Oval 1997 and
Headingley 2001
It is true to say they only won one live rubber in England (Edgbaston 1997).
Hass- Number of posts : 2401
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
When is the next Ashes series?
taipan- Number of posts : 48416
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
10-11 taips..it is on a 4 year cycle
horace- Number of posts : 42573
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
horace wrote:10-11 taips..it is on a 4 year cycle
Good, so will the ghosts of Warne and McGrath be buried by then?
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Hass wrote:The One wrote:JGK wrote:England has never won a Test in Australia in which both Shane Warne and Glenn McGrath played.
and only one in england (1997)
England actually won three matches at home when playing against Warne and McGrath.
Edgbaston 1997
The Oval 1997 and
Headingley 2001
It is true to say they only won one live rubber in England (Edgbaston 1997).
whoops! yes, thats what i meant
The One- Number of posts : 9035
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Re: McGrath and Warne: an appreciation
Amusing how nostalgia creeps in at times like these !!
I seem to recall thinking along similar lines about Gatting, Gooch et al when England got thumped 5-0 in '06/'07 !!
I seem to recall thinking along similar lines about Gatting, Gooch et al when England got thumped 5-0 in '06/'07 !!
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