The WICB/WIPA war of words.................

The WICB told the players on strike that they had until Wednesday to apologise unreservedly to the WICB for going on strike if they wanted to play for the West Indies ever again. This is the WIPA's response...

WE APOLOGISE!

The West Indies Players Association in its response to the WICB’s demand for an apology has issued the following on behalf of its members.

On behalf of all our members, we wish to apologize to the West Indies Cricket Board for our “unreasonable” behaviour in respect of the following:

• For demanding that our members play with a contract clearly outlining the terms and conditions prior to a series or series of matches
• For insisting that all contracts be negotiated by WIPA prior to their being offered to the players, as is provided by the agreements between WIPA and the WICB
• For asking the WICB to honour the agreement and pay the medical treatment when players sustain injuries while representing the West Indies
• For asking that the WICB honour the 2007-2008 agreement that was signed by the Players and compensate the players who have been injured while playing for the West Indies as outlined in the agreement
• For asking the WICB to deposit funds it had deducted from the players’ salaries and which it failed to pay to the Players Provident Fund Account (Pension Plan) for almost a year
• For asking the WICB to reimburse players who sometimes have to purchase their own airline tickets while on duty for the West Indies
• For not having training camps and specialist camps for the preparation of the team so that the players may improve their performances
• For accepting to play in a series against England at a time of year when no other team has ever played in the history of over 100 years of international cricket
• For asking that the WICB not sell players’ intellectual property and image rights without permission
• For tolerating all of the above for far too long out of a desire to wear maroon and for listening to the executive of our association when told that negotiations were in progress and would bear fruit shortly
• For believing that our constitutional right to freedom of association was sacred and would be honoured and respected


The Players would be willing to apologize if the Players had:

(i) Lost Five (5) million US Dollars in the sanctioning of a one-off international 20/20 match as a result of selling rights to a party that already been sold.
(ii) Lost three (3) million US Dollars as a result of breach of agreement.
(iii) Spent one (1) million US Dollars in the courts in London unsuccessfully defending a legal action.
(iv) Made an out of court settlement with a broadcaster for breach of contract.
(v) Had to defend several other claims for breach of contract including one where the estimated loss of revenue is $500,000.00 US Dollars per year.
(vi) Lost almost US $10 million dollars in almost one year for breach of agreements with third parties.
(vii) Were responsible for the debacle in Antigua in which the match was called off because of the poor condition of the ground and for failure to fulfill the expectation that some inquiry or explanation would be forthcoming.
A perusal of the above should indicate from where the apology should come.

I really don't see an end to this anytime soon, do you?

They had to do it sometime. Good thing they did it in a rubbish series instead of a big one.

The players should probably go get some county work.

I am seriously worried about the Champions Trophy and the tour of Australia. I really don't see Cricket Australia accepting a team led by Floyd Reifer..........

The Windies Board can't win this. Sooner or later they'll have to back down or risk the Windies being suspended from international cricket.

Even though the ICC is already showing signs of dilly dallying, pathetic c*nts that they are.

Again, whilst I appreciate your comments about the unnecessarily militant approach of the WIPA; it is difficult to argue with the above including what it represents re. the impunity with which the WICB blunders over the rights and contractual obligations of the players whilst retaining the haughty arrogance of the boss-man so common down here.

Really, what hope for WI cricket whilst being run by such a group of incompetent charletans?

But that is the way down here.

It was in my contract that flights for me and my family and some of the relocation expenses would be reimbursed. 13 months later...not a sign of it, and I wouldn't be surprised if they just said...."we are not going to pay it"....what can I do.....leave....if I did they just shrug and my colleagues have to cover at no extra cost indefinitely.

Same attitude. Sod the consequences for the service that you, the board (Health or Cricket) were set up and are paid to run and deliver on......

Still, sadly for me it is still better than the NHS.

But really, the attitudes of management boards down here are shocking and the WICB have been destroying WI cricket since they refused to pick Desmond Haynes because he remained in England (I think) completing some cricket commitments and missed some training or one warm up game in the WI before a test series.

I didn't realise the player grievances were that manifold. They do fan out to a lot of complex issues. I guess the territorial set-up of the West Indies makes it difficult to get any one single court to pass judgement which applies to and is enforceable in the entirety of the different island nations.

I guess strike was the only way to get the above issues addressed expeditiously. Does this mean the break-up of the WI as a member of the ICC? Is it corruption or a genuine lack of funds?

I think it's incompetence rather than out and out corruption tbh. As doctorspin pointed out, management in the Caribbean is incredibly autocratic and leaders often take the workforce for granted.

How else could we explain the way they have treated the players. They might have got away with it in the past because the players were not exposed to top sports management outside the Caribbean. But Gayle, Bravo, Sarwan, Shiv, Fidel and Taylor are World renowned players and thus have been exposed to modern management systems at the IPL, county cricket (sports mgt has improved dramatically since the 70's and 80's) and a number of them will soon get a mini taste of Aussie state cricket. Therefore they having something to compare the WICB too and it will have become even clearer that they are being screwed over and the issues had to come to a head.

It turns out that the tour of England was very nearly boycotted by the WIPA. It went down to a vote and it was extremely close. I think this goes a long way to explaining the attitude of a lot of the players on that tour as they have clearly had enough and it is only the love of the maroon cap that has kept them going for this long.

Personally, I think responses like this from the WIPA hinder rather than help the situation. As the facts emerge it becomes even clearer that the WICB has continued to behave scandalously, but the WIPA will not help themselves by behaving in this way.

What is Joe Public's reaction to all this WIFAN ?

Surely if, as seems reasonable, they sympathise and perhaps openly support the players, then the WICB would have to back down.

Boards asking for apologies from agrieved players is like throwing a lighted match onto a barrel of gasoline !

Regardless, I do like the itemised WIPA "apology" !

Cheers, Wifan

Personally, I think responses like this from the WIPA hinder rather than help the situation. As the facts emerge it becomes even clearer that the WICB has continued to behave scandalously, but the WIPA will not help themselves by behaving in this way.

But how else can the players force WICB to act. Even if one factors in mismanagement, the catalogue of grievances mentioned above seem to have a long history and the players have shown a fair degree of patience. I wonder if the mismanagement you are alluding to includes the absence of funds to execute the commitments.

It's difficult Merls, as a lot of people have become utterly fed up with the performances on the field and thus blame the current players for everything. The simpletons reaction is 'how dare they ask for more money when they lose mot of the time'.

Anyone who has studied the facts will know that the players are perfectly justified. In fact I think that makes up for most of the cricket lovers in the Caribbean. Both parties are taking out paid advertisements in the national newspapers such as the Jamaica Observer, Trinidad Guardian, Nation News etc to explain their position. Interesting times.

Meanwhile 2 unnamed Jamaicans have apparently broken ranks with the WIPA and have made themselves available for the 2nd test. Rumor is that Brendan Nash is one of them, but I doubt it somehow...

jim rich wrote:Cheers, Wifan

Personally, I think responses like this from the WIPA hinder rather than help the situation. As the facts emerge it becomes even clearer that the WICB has continued to behave scandalously, but the WIPA will not help themselves by behaving in this way.

But how else can the players force WICB to act. Even if one factors in mismanagement, the catalogue of grievances mentioned above seem to have a long history and the players have shown a fair degree of patience. I wonder if the mismanagement you are alluding to includes the absence of funds to execute the commitments.

I agree that the players have been forced to strike and that they had no option. I just feel their tone in press releases and negotiations is not helping to end this horrible situation. Even though their anger is perfectly understandable, it is not going to solve anything IMHO.

Divided they fall ...........

Dwayne Bravo speaks out about the WICB and the way they treat players:

Trinidad Express Q & A

How do you feel about what's happening between you guys and the West Indies Cricket Board?

Well, to be honest, I feel bad about it. It's not something that I like to see happening. It is hurting me a lot. Growing up, my passion was to play for the West Indies, to have a long, successful career. Ever since I started, back in 2004, there were problems with both parties-WICB and WIPA-and it just can't seem to come to an end and now it's getting worse. It's starting to affect players emotionally and more so the fans.

And that is the worst part of it. Whenever I walk the streets I hear people complaining. Cricket means a lot to West Indian people - it is the only unifying sport that we have in the region and I think it's time both parties get together and actually solve the problem. I don't know how long it can go on for. I feel really bad that we are striking and not being able to represent the West Indies but I think we're doing something that pertains to our rights and I think we should all stand up for our rights and hope for the best.

When you first started with the team, what was the reception from the board? How did you feel coming in as a new member of the team?

It wasn't really what I expected. I expected, you know, a bit more. I'm not saying they did anything wrong. But, you know, as a child growing up, your dream is to play for the West Indies cricket team and that's all you want to do.

And actually, when you finally get there, you say to yourself, "This is it? This is all? It can't be like this." It's sad but like I said, I meet it like that. It reach a stage where I don't know what to say about the state of West Indies cricket.

You've talked to players from other cricketing nations, do they have this problem with their boards?

All boards and players' associations have problems but I don't think it's as bad as WICB and WIPA. Other boards, to me, respect their players a bit more and have a better relationship with their players. Speaking to other players and sharing information, sometimes they laugh at us to see the situation that we're in and how they [the WICB] treat us as professional players.

You know, they [WICB] keep harping and saying that we are well paid, the third or fourth highest paid in the world. But we're living in a modernised world now where the salary we get compared to others is chalk and cheese. But we are happy, we are not complaining about our salaries. We just find that as professional players, things should be dealt with in a professional way and our board is not professional enough.

What happened with your injury claims? Did you ever get compensation for the eight months you were recovering?

It's in process now. While I was injured for the eight months, it was nothing like that. They got my surgery done for me. They paid for the flights and that was it. From the time I got back home my whole rehab programme was on my own, everything.

So wait, what happen to the team physiotherapist?

Well, they were on tours and I had to do my rehab here in Trinidad.

And you had to pay for that?

Well yeah. [Name of therapist] doesn't trust the WICB anymore to bill them. I think they had incidents in the past and so no one really trusts to bill them again. I had to take it out of my pocket, which I don't really mind because I do extended sessions.

I even hire two other therapists to do extra work with me because I want to get back into the game. It's not about the money that I'm losing. I just want to make sure I can play cricket again and play comfortably. I already wait eight months. I want to manage myself properly and go back into it at the right time.

Why isn't the West Indies cricket team performing?

It all boils down to the fact that our team has been chopping and changing-that's one of the reasons. Our first-class cricket is nowhere near the standard that it should be compared to other teams in the world and we have to compete amongst the best. The facilities we have in the region are not up to standard for international players.

So there are a lot of reasons why the team hasn't been successful. Obviously a normal fan wouldn't see the back side of it-they'll only see the performance on the field. Our preparation for the youth players come right up to the A Team players is not good and therefore there's a big gap between under-19 cricket and A team cricket to Test cricket. There's a big, big gap and players come in to the West Indies team not really prepared for international cricket and they have to go all the way back and start over.

I don't mean to be critical or to bash anyone but we reach a stage in life now where we travel the world and seen how things are set up in different countries and you ask yourself, 'Why? Why not back home by us?' One of the reasons why Trinidad and Tobago have been so successful in domestic cricket is because we have the best structure in the region. And if it is they can see we are reaping the rewards, why not try and do it in all the other islands? One academy, one indoor facility in every island would not hurt. Hire coaches to come in. I mean, West Indies produce some of the best players in the world - ever. Everywhere we go in the world you hear about the three W's, Malcolm Marshall, Viv Richards, Michael Holding.

Just to draw a reference to the Stanford Super Series: He hire all the legends to come in and work with the players. Most of us there were West Indian players but it was the first time most of us had the opportunity to speak one on one with some of those legends. A lot of us gain a lot. And you see how the result was? It was a one-sided game. [The West Indians whipped the England team soundly.] So I'm not saying they can turn around West Indies cricket immediately. There's process and I think we should make use of those legends.

We have a very young team, they keep chopping and changing. The guys not getting a good, long enough run so therefore when they come in, they try to play for themselves, to cement their spot for the next series and guys can't play their natural game.

How did you feel seeing the West Indies lose to Bangladesh?

Not good at all, to be honest. I was following the game. I was actually in West Mall when I saw the last wicket and there were people standing around me and my reaction was like, it was like I was on the field when I saw Tino Best play that shot. I fling my hands -I just couldn't believe the shot that he played at that time, knowing the situation in the game. Which I expected from him because I've seen him do it on different occasions.

I wasn't really surprised but I thought being out of the game so long and he get an opportunity again now, he might have learnt something or be a smarter cricketer, but it shows that he hasn't done much, hasn't learnt much.

But it all boils down to the fact that when he wasn't around for the last three or four years, what system we have in place? Did they use anyone to work with him? Because he's a talented cricketer. He's a cricketer that if you work with him, he could be one of the best fast bowlers in the world because he can bowl at 90 miles an hour consistently. He's a great fieldsman and he also has good batting ability. But that's a player you need to work with mentally They have done nothing to help him.

And it's not only him-there are a few names I could call off the top of my head. They come on the scene, show a lot of promise, get an injury or get dropped, no one has done anything to help them recover from their injury or get back in the game. Jermaine Lawson is another player. No one knows where he is at this point in time and that's sad to see.

Would you seriously give up your million-dollar contract with the Indian Premier League (IPL) to play for the West Indies? And your new contract with Victoria in Australia?

It's not about the money and people don't really understand that. Yes, it's a good opportunity to make another set of income and it's nice. And it's a lot of money. But if we weren't playing for the West Indies we wouldn't be identified by those teams.

We wouldn't have made a name for ourselves so we understand that and know that we have to make sure that we are always available to play for the West Indies.

Does the WICB or WIPA train or prepare you to deal with the press and criticism?

He shakes his head adamantly.

Nothing? So basically you are left to cope with negative publicity on your own?

Well, yeah, basically you're left to do a lot for yourself. They keep saying you're a professional unit but do we get treated like a professional team? I don't think so. A lot of the players feel the same way.

Okay, let's look at some of WIPA's grievances: payment for medical treatment on tour, pensions, now this thing about airline tickets-if you are in Trinidad, the WICB doesn't pay for your ticket to get to where you're playing?

It depends. If let's say I get a call-up to play for the West Indies, I get to the airport, the ticket is there. There are times when you go to the airport and your ticket not there. Then we call [Dinanath] Ramnarine [CEO of WIPA] and he will buy a ticket. Sometimes you come back from tour-every time we travel we land in Barbados to get a connecting flight. The players go to the desk, no tickets there. You call Ramnarine. That's what I'm talking about, the unprofessionalism.

It sounds like they just need a good PA (personal assistant).

They just do things badly. They send guys on tour two days before a series and stuff like that your uniform arriving late. No one can actually believe how-the West Indies is the biggest, you can't go bigger than that in the region. But my club, Queen's Park Cricket Club, is more organised than West Indies.

WIFAN wrote:I think it's incompetence rather than out and out corruption tbh. As doctorspin pointed out, management in the Caribbean is incredibly autocratic and leaders often take the workforce for granted.

How else could we explain the way they have treated the players. They might have got away with it in the past because the players were not exposed to top sports management outside the Caribbean. But Gayle, Bravo, Sarwan, Shiv, Fidel and Taylor are World renowned players and thus have been exposed to modern management systems at the IPL, county cricket (sports mgt has improved dramatically since the 70's and 80's) and a number of them will soon get a mini taste of Aussie state cricket. Therefore they having something to compare the WICB too and it will have become even clearer that they are being screwed over and the issues had to come to a head.

It turns out that the tour of England was very nearly boycotted by the WIPA. It went down to a vote and it was extremely close. I think this goes a long way to explaining the attitude of a lot of the players on that tour as they have clearly had enough and it is only the love of the maroon cap that has kept them going for this long.

Personally, I think responses like this from the WIPA hinder rather than help the situation. As the facts emerge it becomes even clearer that the WICB has continued to behave scandalously, but the WIPA will not help themselves by behaving in this way.

WIFAN: I disagree. WIPA's complaints are substantive; sometimes you have to put personal before company/nation, etc. It is appalling how the players have been treated. If it means West Indies cricket is 'dispersed' temporarily, and that the dinosaur WICB ceases to exist, a phoenix organisation is likely emerge.

Yeah I agree with the strike action and fervently hope this forces change within the WICB. I just disagree with the wording of their sarcastic apology which is unlikely to bring things any closer to a resolution.

WIFAN wrote:Yeah I agree with the strike action and fervently hope this forces change within the WICB. I just disagree with the wording of their sarcastic apology which is unlikely to bring things any closer to a resolution.

But it is that sarcasm that exposes how WICB have treated their players. I wasn't aware of the depth of West Indian players' complaint till I read that 'apology' - WICB are disgraceful.

Trinidad chief raises prospect of split from Windies

CommentWest Indies cricket, which has united the islands of the Caribbean for over a century, could be split if the chief of Trinidad and Tobago's cricket body follows through his idea of competing as independent nation.

In an interview published on Tuesday, Trinidad and Tobago Cricket Board (TTCB) chief executive Forbes Persaud said leading figures in the country's cricket body are considering breaking away from the West Indies regional team.

West Indies cricket is in crisis after leading players refused to play in the home series against Bangladesh due to contractual disputes with the regional board, and the tourists took advantage by winning both Tests against a weakened team.

"My personal view (is) if the trend continues with the manner in which West Indies cricket is being administered, the board (TTCB) should go on its own and compete as Trinidad and Tobago, just as is in football," he told the Trinidad and Tobago Express.

"If something is not done to have cricket administration at the West Indies level properly restructured, I believe we will have no choice but to think about playing as an individual territory on the international scene."

Trinidad and Tobago has been one of the traditional powerhouses of West Indian cricket along with Barbados and Jamaica.

Cricket is the only sport in which the former British colonies still compete as one unit -- all the Caribbean nations play soccer and compete in the Olympics independently.

The West Indies Players' Association, the players union at the centre of the dispute with the West Indies Cricket Board (WICB), is based in Trinidad and, on Sunday, leading Trinidad and international player Dwayne Bravo [ Images ] hit out at the WICB saying his local club was better organised than the regional body.

Persaud said that his view on a split was a personal one and there had not been formal discussions at board level -- but other members shared his view.

"There are some board members who believe that we should start thinking about going on our own but, this has not been discussed in any official forum. It's just people expressing their views informally."

Asked if such views were growing, Persaud responded: "Yes. Because of the present situation in West Indies cricket, people are becoming very disenchanted and they have been expressing their views along these lines."

Persaud said that the process would not happen overnight.

"Even if we were to go that way, it would be a very long, drawn out process," he added.

"It would have to go through the ICC and we must bear in mind the repercussions it is going to have and the impact it would have on the West Indian community since we know how passionate the Caribbean people are about cricket.

"We all know how critical West Indies cricket is as a unifying force, to go that way would be destroying a legacy. It is not going to be an easy decision to make, if at all there is going to be a formal discussion on this."

Lloyd and Holding on WICB and WIPA
A real eye-opener. The problem is more complex than I imagined. Are player demands exaggerated to an extent that the Board can't function? Or is the Board incompetent and can't adapt to the management techniques of today? A bit of both, I guess.

Expecting the same remuneration as the Indian market offers is illusionary, players should realise as the numbers, both sponsorships and tv supplements, do not allow such financial exuberance.

The old players are not to be trusted in terms of their opinions on this matter. A number of them are quite simply jealous about the money in the game nowadays and behave terribly towards the younger players.

For example, Sir CLive Lloyd says we have a regular player who is a millionaire averaging 15 with the bat. That is a load of carp, unless you are talking about Jerome Taylor who happens to be a fuggin fast bowler.

This latest action is not about money, it is about terms and conditions. The older players cannot seem to fathom this, they just go on and on about money when the players are happy with what they earn, they are simply unhappy with the lack of respect they are given by the board.