There are too many ordinary teams in test cricket

by Henry Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:18

The gap between India, South Africa, Australia, England and Sri Lanka compared with Pakistan, the Windies, New Zealand and Bangladesh is the widest it's ever been. Out of 9 test nations, 4 of them are completely uncompetetive against the top 5.

Time for a 2 tier test system, with one up and one down at the end of each year.

by tac Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:19

for the last 15 years no one could really compete with Oz and for 15 before that with the Windies . . . having 4-5 teams who are competitive is a great improvement . . .

by Basil Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:22

Henry wrote:The gap between India, South Africa, Australia, England and Sri Lanka compared with Pakistan, the Windies, New Zealand and Bangladesh is the widest it's ever been. Out of 9 test nations, 4 of them are completely uncompetetive against the top 5.

Time for a 2 tier test system, with one up and one down at the end of each year.

That would be impractical - the cyclewould have to be five years to allow for home and away series.

by Henry Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:23

Yeah it's good that there's competition at the top, but something still needs to be done about the bottom. I think most fans of the top 5 teams wouldn't mind if their teams played each other all the time and didn't worry about playing Bangladesh/Pakistan etc. There's just no point at the moment.

by Zat Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:24

Henry wrote:The gap between India, South Africa, Australia, England and Sri Lanka compared with Pakistan, the Windies, New Zealand and Bangladesh is the widest it's ever been. Out of 9 test nations, 4 of them are completely uncompetetive against the top 5.

There are too many ordinary teams in test cricket Captain_obvious

by Henry Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:25

Basil wrote:
Henry wrote:The gap between India, South Africa, Australia, England and Sri Lanka compared with Pakistan, the Windies, New Zealand and Bangladesh is the widest it's ever been. Out of 9 test nations, 4 of them are completely uncompetetive against the top 5.

Time for a 2 tier test system, with one up and one down at the end of each year.

That would be impractical - the cyclewould have to be five years to allow for home and away series.

Well maybe every 2 years. But 5 years is too long. Imagine if England got stuck in the second division for 5 years. Financial disaster. Unless exceptions were given and they were still allowed to play the ashes.

by beamer Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:25

Until recently it seemed like the top 8 sides were getting closer together and you would back the home side in most series.

Pakistan are crippled by politics and infighting but have talent, similarly WI have had problems but at full strength can win series at home. NZ haven't recovered from recent retirements in the batting line-up but their bowling attack is no worse than most others - even Bangladesh are making slow progress. There's no outstanding side and one of the weaker teams could easily climb the table quite quickly if they discover a couple of stars.

by Guest Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:27

Two tier test system would never work as it would feck up the Ashes.

by Basil Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:30

Henry wrote:
Basil wrote:
Henry wrote:The gap between India, South Africa, Australia, England and Sri Lanka compared with Pakistan, the Windies, New Zealand and Bangladesh is the widest it's ever been. Out of 9 test nations, 4 of them are completely uncompetetive against the top 5.

Time for a 2 tier test system, with one up and one down at the end of each year.

That would be impractical - the cyclewould have to be five years to allow for home and away series.

Well maybe every 2 years. But 5 years is too long. Imagine if England got stuck in the second division for 5 years. Financial disaster. Unless exceptions were given and they were still allowed to play the ashes.

Precisely why it ain't going to happen.

by Zat Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:32

Cricket goes in cycles, teams are stronger at some times, and weaker at others.

The biggest problem in cricket is the mismatches.

The rankings system needs to be applied in some way to minimise the number of mismatches.

Here's n off-the-cuff suggestion that might work.

Keep the FTP in place, but bring in some rules as to the length of series between sides, with the length of the next series between two teams to be decided on the rankings 12-14 months in advance (instead of up to 6 years.)

Teams within the top 4 should always play 5 or 6 Test series against each other.

Teams within 2 rankings spots of their oppposition should play 3 or 4 Tests ina series.

Teams further apart than that should be limited to one-off Tests or two-Test series.

ODIs - no more than the number of Test in the accompanying series.

No more than 5 matches in standalone series.

t20s - one or two per series as per current arrangements.

by beamer Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:34

vilkrang wrote:Two tier test system would never work as it would feck up the Ashes.

So you think Australia would be in line to drop into the second tier then? There are too many ordinary teams in test cricket Icon_wink

by Guest Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:34

Sadly it looks as though 6 test series are a thing of the past and 5 match series only seem to be happening with the ashes these days.

by Zat Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:35

Which is why there needs to be 5 Test series mandated between the top teams.

It was ludicrous that India and South Africa played a 2 Test series to determine the top spot.

by Henry Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:35

Or they could just unofficially make a 2 tier system by hardly ever scheduling the mismatched teams against each other. I think that's the way they're gonna go in the next 2-3 years. For example, don't expect Pakistan and the Windies to visit Aus in the same summer again anytime soon.

by Guest Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:37

Zat wrote:Which is why there needs to be 5 Test series mandated between the top teams.

It was ludicrous that India and South Africa played a 2 Test series to determine the top spot.

Aye that was shocking, could have and should have been a classic series.

by Henry Sat 20 Mar 2010, 23:39

vilkrang wrote:
Zat wrote:Which is why there needs to be 5 Test series mandated between the top teams.

It was ludicrous that India and South Africa played a 2 Test series to determine the top spot.
Aye that was shocking, could have and should have been a classic series.

Well you can't really blame anyone for that series. It was originally meant to be a 7 match JAMODI bore fest, so fair play to the BCCI and CSA for changing it to a test series, even if it was only 2 matches.

by Growler Sun 21 Mar 2010, 00:52

Zat wrote:Cricket goes in cycles, teams are stronger at some times, and weaker at others.

The biggest problem in cricket is the mismatches.

The rankings system needs to be applied in some way to minimise the number of mismatches.

Here's n off-the-cuff suggestion that might work.

Keep the FTP in place, but bring in some rules as to the length of series between sides, with the length of the next series between two teams to be decided on the rankings 12-14 months in advance (instead of up to 6 years.)

Teams within the top 4 should always play 5 or 6 Test series against each other.

Teams within 2 rankings spots of their oppposition should play 3 or 4 Tests ina series.

Teams further apart than that should be limited to one-off Tests or two-Test series.

ODIs - no more than the number of Test in the accompanying series.

No more than 5 matches in standalone series.

t20s - one or two per series as per current arrangements.

Agree with the general principles here Zat. I'd slightly modify the tour length criteria though. With your proposal, if England were ranked 5th by even a single point, we'd have 2 Test Ashes series Evil or Very Mad

........

Since the tendency (at least here in England) is now to hold 7 Tests per year, we could play each of the 8 other nations every 4 years, whilst still keeping the traditional long series such as the Ashes, and South Africa. I'd have a 2/5 series split every other year, alternating with a 4/3 or 3/1/3 split. Here's how I'd see it working from 2013 - 2020 if it were planned & implemented now

2013 Bangles 2 Tests followed by 5 match Ashes

2014 Pakistan & India - stronger team get four matches, weaker side three

2015 WI 2 Tests followed by SA for 5 match series

2016 Bangles 1 Test, SLanka & Snoozers 3 each - series played in any order

2017 Weaker of Ind / Pak 2 matches then 5 Test Ashes

2018 Whichever of Ind / Pak didn't play 2017 plus WIndies - stronger side plays four, weaker three

2019 Snoozers 2 Tests then SA for 5

2020 SL and whichever of Ind/Pak had 2 matches in 2017 - 3 Tests each and one for Bangles

A bit of forethought to our o/seas tours would also prevent the stupidity of back to back away & home series which we saw recently with WI and NZ with Bangladesh to come next month, while having 6 or more years before playing Pakistan for example.

One final point - with the exeption of Bangladesh games ........ I would not have 2 match series alter the ranking positions.

by Zat Sun 21 Mar 2010, 01:33

Cheers Growler.

My suggestion was off-the-cuff, as I said. Some tweaking would indeed be needed.

by PlanetPakistan Sun 21 Mar 2010, 01:34

i would have agreed with Henry's suggestion IF Pakistan were a top 5 side and since they are NOT we shall wait for a while and apply the 2 tier system as SOON as they get there.

by PeterCS Sun 21 Mar 2010, 02:08

Ordinary in the extreme. Hear-hear.

All teams should forthwith be required to wear full evening dress during play, to eliminate this lamentable modern tendency toward vulgarity.

by Growler Sun 21 Mar 2010, 02:14

Quite so, Peter. Time the hoi-polloi remembered their place, eh what ?

by PeterCS Sun 21 Mar 2010, 02:15

Absolutely, absolutely.

by PeterCS Sun 21 Mar 2010, 02:19

There are too many ordinary teams in test cricket

There are too many ordinary teams in test cricket

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