Re: Will Australia sink as low as the Windies?

by taipan Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:22 pm

Gold

by taipan Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:24 pm

beamer wrote:Would you really back this Australia side to win away series in Pakistan (UAE) or Sri Lanka?

I think they might battle in UAE and as SL don't play tests, the point is moot.

by Brass Monkey Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:44 pm

Yeah - definitely gold

by horace Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:55 pm

straight to the gold thread with gary's documentary

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:54 pm

skully wrote:My simple answer to Trev's question is "No". We are always competitive at home, and as Wally says, our bowlers are still world class.

I slightly disagree with this. I think our pace bowling stocks and depth are world-class but none of the bowlers have quite reached heights close to Steyn/Anderson yet.

Henry wrote:

Scary but true.

by Big Dog Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:56 pm

This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

by lardbucket Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:58 pm

Good work Gary.

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:02 pm

Brass Monkey wrote:I think that Aus are one batsmen away from being more than competitive. It was only 7ish months ago that they were toe-to-toe with South Africa. Similar personnel. I think everyone is going overboard a little - their game against spin bowling is the big weakness. It has cost them 5 of the 6 Tests. How many teams are going to be able to exploit this? In the other Test of their six losses they came up against Anderson, who seemed to be at the height of his powers.

OK, they couldn't travel back in time to face a younger, low in confidence Anderson, who had just come back from injury, had barely any FC cricket behind him and didn't know his game inside out. They should be admonished for that. I mean, why they HELL couldn't they just travel back in time, befriend Matthew Hayden, tell him they love his cooking, have a barbie round his house, talk about God, talk about coriander, talk about the state of fishing in the Burdekin River, talk about how Lara Bingle and Michael Clarke make a super couple, THEN talk about how they're going to destroy James Anderson all together in a jolly group. Then roll up to Brisbane and begin to MERCILESSLY RAPE James Anderson.

What sort of batsmen are they?

Simple analysis can help us in this regard. These are the questions that must be asked: How fast are they scoring their runs? How tall are they? Can they play late seam movement? Did they shore up well against Pakistan? Are they gay? Are they South African? When did they last play pin the tail on the donkey? Was that donkey an Indian fielder? If so, was the Indian fielder a Pakistani in disguise? Have they seen much of David Warner? Can they play with madness? Have they got a whole homunculus fallacy thing going on? Have they got a whole Oprah Winfrey thing going on? Finally, and most importantly, what's their favourite sandwich?

If we can mete it out with them, they'll be a lot better off.

Toe-toe with South Africa? Aus were lucky to draw in Brisbane, couldn't get 1 wicket in Adelaide and threw in the towel at Perth. Taking away home advantage and it was an average series.

Australia has ONE settled batsman, in fact you could say ONE settled player in the whole squad. The other batsmen haven't claimed their places, the wicketkeeper got a recall whilst holding a zimmer frame and the bowlers are always rotated.

Not sure who after Clarke, has played the most test consecutively.

by lardbucket Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:04 pm

Until recently it would have been Lyon and Cowan

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:17 pm

Must be Siddle then. Was he dropped at all in India?

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:17 pm

Big Dog wrote:This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

"Your biggest salary cap should be your state contracts with the smaller salary cap being your Big Bash," Arthur had said when coach of Western Australia. "If we're really serious in Australia about getting Australia to the No. 1 Test-playing side in the world, we should be reflecting that in our salary caps and budgets. You can feel the squeeze just through the salary caps that we have to work with. You're getting a bigger salary cap for six weeks' work over the holiday period than you are for trying to make yourself a Test cricketer. I think that's the wrong way round."

And they sacked the guy who said this...

by horace Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:26 pm

stevie nix - our answer to gary pratt

by Big Dog Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:33 pm

baggygreen wrote:
Big Dog wrote:This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

"Your biggest salary cap should be your state contracts with the smaller salary cap being your Big Bash," Arthur had said when coach of Western Australia. "If we're really serious in Australia about getting Australia to the No. 1 Test-playing side in the world, we should be reflecting that in our salary caps and budgets. You can feel the squeeze just through the salary caps that we have to work with. You're getting a bigger salary cap for six weeks' work over the holiday period than you are for trying to make yourself a Test cricketer. I think that's the wrong way round."

And they sacked the guy who said this...

Yeah...i'm starting to think they sacked the wrong guy. Mr 'teflon' Sutherland should have been first.

by Red Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:14 pm

baggygreen wrote:
Big Dog wrote:This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

"Your biggest salary cap should be your state contracts with the smaller salary cap being your Big Bash," Arthur had said when coach of Western Australia. "If we're really serious in Australia about getting Australia to the No. 1 Test-playing side in the world, we should be reflecting that in our salary caps and budgets. You can feel the squeeze just through the salary caps that we have to work with. You're getting a bigger salary cap for six weeks' work over the holiday period than you are for trying to make yourself a Test cricketer. I think that's the wrong way round."

And they sacked the guy who said this...

Because sadly it's all about boosting the coffers these days. You only have to look at Hussey being flown in to promote the Thunder for next BB to appreciate this. Of course Sutherland has to bear in mind that the ratings for the second test dropped off considerably once Australia started falling in a heap. The bottom line is that the public wants to see a competitive international team not a flourishing BB.

The batting personnel for the SA series was a bit different too with Punter, Hussey and Warner all playing regardless of their varying success. Wade was the keeper but home advantage makes a big difference. It was only the summer before last that India was swept 4-0 and SL 3-0 following the competitive series against SA. You'd still back oz to come out on top against some of the insipid efforts from the sub-continent teams on our soil. When the Windies reached their nadir you couldn't guarantee they would win at home, let alone away.

by pinger Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:32 pm

One of the issues over the last 10 years is losing a lot of good athletes (who play say AFL and cricket) to AFL due to the better chance of playing and getting paid; and the seemingly better organise talent identification and development of the AFL.

AFL Football: 18 teams, squad of 40 each team with an average salary of say $220,000. Play half the year and xbox for the rest whilst rooting supermodels. (720 players)

Cricket: 1 team (national), say 20 contract players, average of about $500,000 and match payments. Play whole year. Look at Boof in changing room.

With the level of sophistication these days of the AFL draft many of them are snapped up before (17) they even get a chance to become mature cricketers, simply on the basis of beep tests and fitness.

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:58 pm

Big Dog wrote:
baggygreen wrote:And they sacked the guy who said this...

Yeah...i'm starting to think they sacked the wrong guy. Mr 'teflon' Sutherland should have been first.

Agreed

Red wrote:
baggygreen wrote:
Big Dog wrote:This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

"Your biggest salary cap should be your state contracts with the smaller salary cap being your Big Bash," Arthur had said when coach of Western Australia. "If we're really serious in Australia about getting Australia to the No. 1 Test-playing side in the world, we should be reflecting that in our salary caps and budgets. You can feel the squeeze just through the salary caps that we have to work with. You're getting a bigger salary cap for six weeks' work over the holiday period than you are for trying to make yourself a Test cricketer. I think that's the wrong way round."

And they sacked the guy who said this...

Because sadly it's all about boosting the coffers these days. You only have to look at Hussey being flown in to promote the Thunder for next BB to appreciate this. Of course Sutherland has to bear in mind that the ratings for the second test dropped off considerably once Australia started falling in a heap. The bottom line is that the public wants to see a competitive international team not a flourishing BB.

The batting personnel for the SA series was a bit different too with Punter, Hussey and Warner all playing regardless of their varying success. Wade was the keeper but home advantage makes a big difference. It was only the summer before last that India was swept 4-0 and SL 3-0 following the competitive series against SA. You'd still back oz to come out on top against some of the insipid efforts from the sub-continent teams on our soil. When the Windies reached their nadir you couldn't guarantee they would win at home, let alone away.

Couldn't care less about which pyjama cricket team has which player but it is interesting that CA are supplementing his contract just so he can move there

by skully Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:19 pm

Big Dog wrote:This says it all imho:

http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013/content/story/653981.html

In a nut-shell, T20 has farked our cricket, in more ways than one.

by PeterCS Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:31 pm

Big Bash - Pom master plan.

by taipan Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:34 pm

I would suggest the T20 is oly a symptom of the total mismanagement by CA

by Brass Monkey Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:45 pm

baggygreen wrote:Toe-toe with South Africa? Aus were lucky to draw in Brisbane, couldn't get 1 wicket in Adelaide and threw in the towel at Perth. Taking away home advantage and it was an average series.

Eh? You had SA effectively 50/5 at Brisbane and it took an outstanding effort from SA to prevent a loss at Adelaide.

by baggygreen Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:30 pm

And once South Africa stopped under-performing Australia got hammered.

by Red Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:58 pm

Brass Monkey wrote:
baggygreen wrote:Toe-toe with South Africa? Aus were lucky to draw in Brisbane, couldn't get 1 wicket in Adelaide and threw in the towel at Perth. Taking away home advantage and it was an average series.

Eh? You had SA effectively 50/5 at Brisbane and it took an outstanding effort from SA to prevent a loss at Adelaide.

Think that might oversimplify matters though. They had us on toast at 2 for 200 odd and then we lost a day through rain. They seemed a bit betwixt and between as to how to play it from then on. As it turned out after Amla was gunned and refused to review, they lost quick wickets they may not have otherwise done trying to force the pace. They then had our top order out in no time but Clarke and Hussey in a long partnership then left them vulnerable. Of course they played the whole test one man down because of Duminy's injury. They probably were a bit short of match practice when they arrived and peaked in Perth. That's one thing that England did really well the last time they toured. They played lots of warm-up games and had a shadow squad while the Aussies were fluffing around with limited overs stuff.

by taipan Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:07 pm

Red wrote:
Brass Monkey wrote:
baggygreen wrote:Toe-toe with South Africa? Aus were lucky to draw in Brisbane, couldn't get 1 wicket in Adelaide and threw in the towel at Perth. Taking away home advantage and it was an average series.

Eh? You had SA effectively 50/5 at Brisbane and it took an outstanding effort from SA to prevent a loss at Adelaide.

Think that might oversimplify matters though. They had us on toast at 2 for 200 odd and then we lost a day through rain. They seemed a bit betwixt and between as to how to play it from then on. As it turned out after Amla was gunned and refused to review, they lost quick wickets they may not have otherwise done trying to force the pace. They then had our top order out in no time but Clarke and Hussey in a long partnership then left them vulnerable. Of course they played the whole test one man down because of Duminy's injury. They probably were a bit short of match practice when they arrived and peaked in Perth. That's one thing that England did really well the last time they toured. They played lots of warm-up games and had a shadow squad while the Aussies were fluffing around with limited overs stuff.

Fluffing Round? Explains a lot.

by JKLever Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:14 pm

Brass Monkey wrote:
baggygreen wrote:Toe-toe with South Africa? Aus were lucky to draw in Brisbane, couldn't get 1 wicket in Adelaide and threw in the towel at Perth. Taking away home advantage and it was an average series.

Eh? You had SA effectively 50/5 at Brisbane and it took an outstanding effort from SA to prevent a loss at Adelaide.

We were 50 runs away from drawing the series 1-1 at Lords last year yet something tells me you wouldn't have considered us to have gone toe-to-toe with the saffers in that series Wink

by Chivalry Augustus Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:45 am

Australia are done. Their infrastructure is gone. Their board has seen the $$$ and run. They'll not be a force for a very long time. When they saw what was going on in the IPL, it became a selfish race for money - for the individuals and the boards alike. Talent-wise there hasn't been an Australia side with as poor a batting line-up as this. Michael Clarke is their best batsman - and he's an FTB who's hidden away at 5 where he can play the Ian Bell role of coming in and smashing it around when the going's good, and getting out meekly when the going's bad. He can't score runs outside of Australia and he can't score runs higher than 5. And he's an over-rated captain whose so-called imagination is founded upon him doing silly things.

The team as a collective can't play spin and their bowlers can't keep two body parts together for more than 5 minutes even with super glue. Oh, except for the Vegan fella who is supposedly soft and weak like all faggoty non-meat eaters. 'Cause that's Australian culture for you - meat = man. Think of how many overs the guy could bowl if he wasn't such a puff.

Apart from all that they'll be absolutely fine.

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