Islam - what is it all about?

As pointed out earlier Islam is where Christianity was all those centuries ago. Unfortunately, in the same way there is going to be a lot of blood shed and misery globally, before these blind followers get off their self righteous beliefs of having the "ultimate answers". Again as pointed out earlier religion specificallly organised religion is perhaps the easiest tool for mind control and power grabbing. No difference to a cult really.

The problem with most organised religions is that the kids are brain washed before they are even seven years old. And the popular psychology here at play is "Give me a child before seven and I will have him / her for life".

Batman wrote:young jehadis in the Middle East were brainwashed and promised 72 virgins in heaven on commiting a suicide bombing for the 'holy cause'.....

Where do I sign up?

You're one of the Virgins...

JGK wrote:You're one of the Virgins...

You guessed

The One wrote:phurt. nothing to do with islam per se. some shocking incidents by hindus in orissa and karnataka as well, not to forget gujarat

religion, due to its demands of blind faith, seems to attract lunatics better than any other organisation or belief. esp lunatics who are willing to kill in its name

Incidentally, the incidents in Gujarat trasnpired after an Islamic attack on a train where a coach full of Hindu activists were burnt. It was a reactionary retaliation. What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

JGK wrote:You're one of the Virgins...

Batman wrote:............ What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

Conversion does not justify retaliatory killings/ violence.

There's no point in even comparing them.

Batman wrote:

The One wrote:phurt. nothing to do with islam per se. some shocking incidents by hindus in orissa and karnataka as well, not to forget gujarat

religion, due to its demands of blind faith, seems to attract lunatics better than any other organisation or belief. esp lunatics who are willing to kill in its name

Incidentally, the incidents in Gujarat trasnpired after an Islamic attack on a train where a coach full of Hindu activists were burnt. Itw as a reactionary retaliation. What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

yes. "spontaneous reaction/expression of feelings" - the thackeray/vhp defence. murder and rape is still murder and rape, esp if your targets are mostly people who are innocent themselves

furriner wrote:

Batman wrote:............ What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

Conversion does not justify retaliatory killings/ violence.

There's no point in even comparing them.

Not merely conversion. Both sides have been resorting to violence on both sides. Last eyar some christian missionaries attacked Swami Laxmanand leading to violence. This year he was assasinated and it emerges some key religious groups paid for his assasination and for resources to Maoists for killing him......

Batman wrote:

The One wrote:phurt. nothing to do with islam per se. some shocking incidents by hindus in orissa and karnataka as well, not to forget gujarat

religion, due to its demands of blind faith, seems to attract lunatics better than any other organisation or belief. esp lunatics who are willing to kill in its name

Incidentally, the incidents in Gujarat trasnpired after an Islamic attack on a train where a coach full of Hindu activists were burnt. It was a reactionary retaliation. What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

Oh come on. That's bullshit. Three days of organised, systematic, state backed genocide is reactionary? Bullshit. I'm continually amazed people can even try and label, what was really mass-murder of a particular community, unhindered by the police, backed by the government, as reactionary. I wouldn't be surprised if most of them weren't happy Godhra happened so they could cut muslim throats and rape muslim women. Tehelka has most of the top bosses on video, so I think you can watch how reactionary it really was. I think it's disgraceful how people try to give a spin on Gujarat.

Burning Christians alive because they had the temerity to preach their religion, which is their constitutional right is reactionary? Reactionary religious war? Really? Why shouldn't the tribals convert if they want to? What exactly has the hindu religion done for them?

The Bajrang Dal and VHP, etc., are really as much of a terrorist group as the SIMI and Indian Mujahideen, HuJI, etc. The scary thing is they do it openly while the muslim groups have to do it in hiding. And they do it because of the two big parties, one of them backs them and the other is too emasculated to do anything about it other than issue mild statements

Solution to religious dilemma:

Set aside the executions of the Bali bombers, rape them and then call in al Shabab to stone them.

doremi wrote:

Batman wrote:

The One wrote:phurt. nothing to do with islam per se. some shocking incidents by hindus in orissa and karnataka as well, not to forget gujarat

religion, due to its demands of blind faith, seems to attract lunatics better than any other organisation or belief. esp lunatics who are willing to kill in its name

Incidentally, the incidents in Gujarat trasnpired after an Islamic attack on a train where a coach full of Hindu activists were burnt. It was a reactionary retaliation. What is happening in Orissa is also a reactionary religious war where Christian missionaries are involved in large scale conversion of tribals.

Oh come on. That's bullshit. Three days of organised, systematic, state backed genocide is reactionary? Bullshit. I'm continually amazed people can even try and label, what was really mass-murder of a particular community, unhindered by the police, backed by the government, as reactionary. I wouldn't be surprised if most of them weren't happy Godhra happened so they could cut muslim throats and rape muslim women. Tehelka has most of the top bosses on video, so I think you can watch how reactionary it really was. I think it's disgraceful how people try to give a spin on Gujarat.

Burning Christians alive because they had the temerity to preach their religion, which is their constitutional right is reactionary? Reactionary religious war? Really? Why shouldn't the tribals convert if they want to? What exactly has the hindu religion done for them?

The Bajrang Dal and VHP, etc., are really as much of a terrorist group as the SIMI and Indian Mujahideen, HuJI, etc. The scary thing is they do it openly while the muslim groups have to do it in hiding. And they do it because of the two big parties, one of them backs them and the other is too emasculated to do anything about it other than issue mild statements

No one is justifying, but fact is Gujarat riots and mayhem could not have been planned to the point where islamists set the train on fire and a Congress elected mullah would not have been the main accused even as he went absconding. How would you term a ruling 'national' party like Congress butchering 3,000 sikhs for 3 days just because a sikh bodyguard shot dead their leader and prime minister Indira Gandhi? or the Congress inspired partition that led to a slaughter of more than half a million people both sides of the border? Answers are never that easy to come by unfortunately. I don't approve what VHP and Bajrang Dal do to but so called 'Psuedo' Secular parties are responsible for their over the top minority especially muslim appeasement. No other country in the world sees such a lop sided politics where the majority community, their rights, their merits and even their religion and Gods are abused to the extent that they are now. When Islamic terrorism is accepted worldwide, India lives in denial saying terrorism has no religion and terrorists shouldn't be called Muslim terrorists to protect sensitivities of so called minorities but the same bastiches are quick to run a systemetic media campaign to invent and criticise so called 'Hindu terrorism'? Suddenly where is this term coming from and why before elections? Aren't they the very people who have been saying that terrorism has no religion and that religions should not be associated with terrorism? Why two sets of rules for Hindus and Muslims? If Salman Rushdie criticized something Islamic, he was banned and exiled from India. When M.F. Hussain abuses Hindu Gods and sensibilities with his mindless paintings the Govt. goes all out to give him 'justice'? Terrorists caught in the Delhi encounter last month are called 'innocent students' by our sick 'secular' Govt. and some ministers in the Govt. are even extending them legal help in name of human rights, then why is the same not being considered for the religious Hindu woman recently arrested on same charges? Manmohan Singh lost sleep because an Indian Muslim was caught by Australia whose cell phone was used for bombings in England by his own cousin, and hence accused for terrorism. Then why is the same benefit of doubt not given to this girl before charges are proven? Why doesn't he lose his sleep over 4 million Kashmiris Hindus who have been slaughtered or forced driven out of their homes? The seculars keep blaming Gujarat trying to justify the muslim terrorists causes and sympathising with them, but if the same yardstick applied to Hindus then shouldn't the whole India Hindu society be terrorists by now justly over what has happened to Kashmiri Hindus and over the amount of temples islamic facists there destroyed and abused? And last but not the least, the so called Hindu radicals may be pushed to the extreme because of such dangerous pro-terrorist policies [offering pension schemes to killed terrorists who killed hundreds of innocents] but they are certainly not sold to enemy powers outside of country to destroy and bleed India the way organizations like SIMI are commited to. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction and the more these communal 'secular' bastiches side and pamper the so called minorities [note that Muslims are second largest community and definately not in minority as compared to sikhs, buddhists, parsis etc.] the more polarized the society gets and that many more Hindus will slowly but surely retliate the only way they can since the Govt. is not willing to see or hear anything beyond their selfish votebanks.

TO and Doremi: Here is a classic example of why the Hindus feel threatened and why the likes of Bajrang Dal and VHP will get stronger. DMK leader Karunandhi who abused Lord Rama no end and would not have abused Jesus or Allah ever and this so called athiest has attended Muslim Rozas and praised their fasting as an act of purity but abuses Hindus fasting as and dismisses them as 'Brahminical dictatorship'. He now questions Hindu rites as is seen in today's report but has never questioned Muslim, Sikh and Christain faith:

Flaying the Hindu practice of smearing ash or saffron or sporting a 'tilak' on the forehead for yet another time, Tamil Nadu Chief Minister M Karunanidhi questioned the need for ‘such things in a country which preached equality of all religions’.
Karunanidhi also questioned the rationale behind Brahmins wearing sacred thread.

"What is the need for these things in a country that has accepted all religions and preached equality of the same," he asked in a poem penned by him in the wake of caste-related violence in Madurai on Tuesday in which one person was killed in police firing.

He had on earlier occasions also ridiculed the practice of smearing ash or saffron on the forehead.

In the height of the Sethusamudram controversy, he had described Lord Ram as a ‘drunkard’ and wondered whether he was a qualified engineer to have built the Ramasethu.

In the poem, Karunanidhi described truth as God, adding that all people were equal before God and described as ‘ignorance’ those who were not aware of it.

"Caste differences are the offshoot of the branches called differences based on religion. Let’s chop off not only the branches but also uproot the tree to witness the emergence of a beautiful concept called equality," he said.

He also described as useless the face-off between believers and non-believers on the concept of God and said there was no point fighting over which faith was supreme.

On one hand he calls all religions equal and then questions Hindu rites without realizing they are a part of religion. Why are dead bodies in Hinduism cremated and in Islamic and Christian societies buried? Why do Parsis turn their dead to the vultures? Why is he criticizing Hindu rituals and not questioning Islamics who accept no religion as their equal or question sikh tradition of compulsarily wearing a turban or keeping a dagger? Every reilgion has it's own traditions and yet he chooses to question only one religion all the time to prove his 'Secular' credentials. And this is the same guy who backs terrorists like LTTE in Lanka. This is the same pig who wants 100% reservations for all so called 'lower castes' and yet talks of 'equality' for all. See the point? With leaders like this the Hindu patience and tolerance is pushed to the extreme and a violent retaliation was always on the cards.

It is because of leaders like him, Congress, Mulayam [Chief promoter of SIMI in UP who allowed them freedom to build their terrorist network] etc. that things now have come to such a pass. Just a matter of time before the Hindu youth take to arms by millions. I give another 20 years before India is ripped apart and another 10 years before a bloody civil war erupts everywhere.

maybe you need to read up a bit more of tamil nadu's history to understand their hostility towards hinduism. its not a new age 'secular' thing

but yes, everyone should be free to criticise all religions. criticising islam severely will probably get you beaten up or worse, but the people in the wrong in that case are the aggressors, not the people who speak

india has a long way to go. its still full of religious nuts. we need less of them, not more

Batman wrote:Why two sets of rules for Hindus and Muslims?

you are a cretin par excellence just like all communalists. just because you are a screwed communalist with a sectarian worldview, that does not mean others are that way.

when i look at justice, i could not care less about the religious identity/caste/language/tribe of the perpetrator or the victim. do you even understand this concept, twit ?

A communalist is a stupid beast who thinks in terms of "justice for hindus","justice for muslims","justice for christians" etc, instead of just believing in justice and fairplay baed on facts and evidence alone. That is your problem. only a fool blames others for his own flaws.

a communalist (like you) is essentially a discriminatory person with different set of rules for upper caste hindus and groups you may not like - muslims,sc's/st's.

you are a communalist. communalism is your ideology. just like racism, communalism is discriminatory intrinsically.

you have nothing to do with equality or secular humanism, you stupid deluded creature. you are being a shameless hypocrite talking about values you neither practise or believe in.

No other country in the world sees such a lop sided politics where the majority community, their rights, their merits and even their religion and Gods are abused to the extent that they are now.

ROFL! RSS is not even original.. are you even aware that this is standard nonsense mouthed by far right and right wing groups around the world ,you stupid ignoramus?

you are a just a gullible fool supporting a fraud gang. the sangh parivar is as fraudulent as any of those numerous godmen who con our people.

for instance, why can't RSS and hindu mahasabha fight aginst the mighty british empire? the father of hindutva savarkar cringed before the british for mercy. why was he released by the british from andamaans? why did he cease all anti british/colonialist activities from thereon?

what happens to this"protectors o hindus" when it comes to fighting a strong party like the british empire? why do they pick on weak people alone with rowdies?

do you call this combat ?????? I spit.

All this talk about "sangh parivar for hindus" is pure baloney and fraudulent.

the sangh only wants brahmins to remain dominant and the obc's and dalits to remain subsidary.
some equality....... rofl!

If Salman Rushdie criticized something Islamic, he was banned and exiled from India. When M.F. Hussain abuses Hindu Gods and sensibilities with his mindless paintings the Govt. goes all out to give him 'justice'?

you are a bloody joker. Thackeray, modi are sitting pretty nicely in their homes having carried out pogroms in the past. how shameless and a travesty of justice that is???

what action has been taken against the numerous uncivilised actions of the hindutva garbage?yotally unsatisfactory.

he lose his sleep over 4 million Kashmiris Hindus who have been slaughtered or forced driven out of their homes?

excuse me. these kashmiri hindus" or "palestininean muslims" are not valid humanitarian concerns at all. human empathy has to be driven by compassion and a desire to do good and IRRESPECTIVE OF THE VICTIM'S IDENTITY.

not to promote the sectarian agenda of the sangh or based on sectarian solidarity. is muslim blood any less valuable than hindu blood? os is a christian blood any less valuable than muslim blood?

you are proving yourself to be a sicko by discriminating victims and dead bodies as hindus and muslims. shove your crocodile tears up your you know where.

you and your henchmen are just communalists,ignoramus. you just share a racist ideology.

whether communalists are hindu or muslim or christianor jew is immaterial; you ALL are disagreeable human beings with a twisted worldview and a stupiddity that knows no bounds.

That was a bit bland trident, you must tell us what you really feel.

The One wrote:maybe you need to read up a bit more of tamil nadu's history to understand their hostility towards hinduism. its not a new age 'secular' thing

excuse me. even average tamilians are shockd by some of the views of periyar and co.
the more extreme views of the dravidian leaders are not shared by the TN populace at large.

but the main issues like brahmin domination and opposition against hindi imposition strike a deep chord and this coupled weith the public charisma and oratory of the likes of annadurai gave them success in 1967. since then, congress never returned to power.

furriner wrote:That was a bit bland trident, you must tell us what you really feel.

i am typing quickly with limited time and hence you have to excuse me.



1. the main thing a society has to value justice & fairplay if it is to prosper.

justice and fairplay can only be based on facts and evidence.

this racists and communalists divide justice to "justice for whites","justice for hindus","justice for muslims" and that coupled with their hatred and discriminatory attitude towards people of groups they do not like, causes conflicts in society. needless to say, they are hypocritical and stupid becuase they do not realise how discriminatory their ideology and worldview essentially is.

2. all this claim of "protection of hindus","protection of muslims" is pure baloney. it amuses me how people who nothing but promote hatred and kill innocents claim to be "protectors". when they achived nothing . The shameful record of hindutva groups vs the british empire is a case in point.

3. this tendency on part of communalists to view crimes/justice/victimhood in terms of hindu /muslim(i.e religious idneitty) is essentially sick. Its genuine desire for justice, humanity and compassion that is required. not "justice for hindus", "justice for muslims" etc,.

4. communalists are essentially uncivlised people who lower the cvilised standards of society by promoting hatred and prejudice. they do not represent any community or their protection. they just have a racist mentality and ideology.

^ Oh I agree completely with everything you said in terms of the overall analysis.

I was just messing around.

trident wrote:

The One wrote:maybe you need to read up a bit more of tamil nadu's history to understand their hostility towards hinduism. its not a new age 'secular' thing

excuse me. even average tamilians are shockd by some of the views of periyar and co.
the more extreme views of the dravidian leaders are not shared by the TN populace at large.

but the main issues like brahmin domination and opposition against hindi imposition strike a deep chord and this coupled weith the public charisma and oratory of the likes of annadurai gave them success in 1967. since then, congress never returned to power.

I have read tamil Nadu's history and Periyaar. The man was against some malpractices that we all acknowledge from the past and we have moved away from that a lot. He was not against Hindu religion. But his teachings were twisted by Karuna and used to brainwash illeterate poor people to climb the ladder of power and create a great business umpire. Looks like we have a clown in our midst. So why should the so called 'upper castes' suffer in the name of caste based reservations to compensate for imaginary or real suppression supposedly happened 200 years in the past? After independence isn't it the Govt's responsibility to build infrastructure and give equal opportunities to all and treat everuyone equally? Right now the bloody Govt. has set Rs 4 Lakh annual income as a limit for economic bacwardness for the so called 'backward caste'. But that means a person earning 35-40 thousand a month is backwards and a Brahmin who probably earns say 5,000 a month is not poor? What kind of an equality is this where one student is forced to pay full fees and amde to study harder to secure 90% marks to get in a good college and another who is probably richer given a fee waiver by Govt. and given admissions without studying for something as less as 60%? Where is the justice and is this not discrimination. I knew a guy in school who wanted to do MBBS and was poor. His father was a rickshaw driver barely making ends meet and yet he was a so called 'privileged upper caste maratha'. He tried to commit suicide when he missed admission by 2 marks. And there were children of rich ministers and MLAs getting admissions over caste certificate despite not being really backwards. The likes of Karuna just feed off hatred and thrive on turning classes against each other. If a brahmin or a Rajput don't earn even Rs 1000 a month Govt. still doesn't help their children's education and yet if a child of a billionaire minister who doesn't need it is still given because he has a certifcate that says he is from a backward caste. There are equal number of rich and poor in all castes. Poverty does not choose castes and yet insetad of helping poor people uniformly Govt is selectively helping specific communities to win votes and the whole equality and secular concept goes for a toss. Just because he doesn't like Brahmins doesn't mean he abuses the whole community for a past that no one in the present is accountable to. Instead of bringing in reforms that benefit everyone and bridges people, he is busy hating one section and turning them against the rest. You and your Karuna followers are the biggest farksticks in the world. You talk about Thackrey and others, but I don't see a single minister from Congress 'Secular' convicted for their role in sikh riots. Tyler or Bhagat? Was rajiv gandhi tried for war crimes for sending 1300 Indian soldiers to death in Lanka on his ambitious IPKF misadventure? Ministers of Mulayam like Abu Azmi give equally anti-Hindu speeches and help criminal elements and I don't see him booked either. The 'secular forces' went all out to free a terrorist like Madani [Coimbatore blasts] from jail and even bent parliament for the same. I don't see any such anti-social members of Parliament booked. So many ministers in Bihar and UP have 100 cases of murder, extortion, rapes etc. registered and yet they are in Parliament with their court cases in abeyance. Is the problem only limited to so called saffron forces or is myopia natural to you. There was no Thackrey or BJP when Bhagalpur riots happened, when Sikh messacre happened, partition et el or when so many Hindus and sikhs were killed in Kashmir.

Fact is there is no one who is not bad enough and all politicians are screwed. If one were to use history as a yardstick and use it to screw present by way of secterian and divisive policies than perhaps India should be in a state of perpetual war forever with different communities killing and bombing each other every single day.

The truth is that every religion must get equal treatment without caste or religion certificate but since our 'secular' minsters are hell bent on doing the opposite, the bloodbath will continue to flow till equality is not determined on economic realities of current times. Till then Hindus cannot solely be blamed for the myopic Govt. policies that is hellbent on dividing them and turning against one another. Why did the secular parties allow linguistic identities and caste based politics that has created corrupt regional political rogues now? Why does the Govt give so much importance to caste, sub-caste, religion, language etc. of it's citizens on every Govt. form and why is economic parity not the sole factor for public benefit policies?

trident wrote:

Batman wrote:Why two sets of rules for Hindus and Muslims?

you are a cretin par excellence just like all communalists. just because you are a screwed communalist with a sectarian worldview, that does not mean others are that way.

when i look at justice, i could not care less about the religious identity/caste/language/tribe of the perpetrator or the victim. do you even understand this concept, twit ?

A communalist is a stupid beast who thinks in terms of "justice for hindus","justice for muslims","justice for christians" etc, instead of just believing in justice and fairplay baed on facts and evidence alone. That is your problem. only a fool blames others for his own flaws.

a communalist (like you) is essentially a discriminatory person with different set of rules for upper caste hindus and groups you may not like - muslims,sc's/st's.

you are a communalist. communalism is your ideology. just like racism, communalism is discriminatory intrinsically.

you have nothing to do with equality or secular humanism, you stupid deluded creature. you are being a shameless hypocrite talking about values you neither practise or believe in.

No other country in the world sees such a lop sided politics where the majority community, their rights, their merits and even their religion and Gods are abused to the extent that they are now.

ROFL! RSS is not even original.. are you even aware that this is standard nonsense mouthed by far right and right wing groups around the world ,you stupid ignoramus?

you are a just a gullible fool supporting a fraud gang. the sangh parivar is as fraudulent as any of those numerous godmen who con our people.

for instance, why can't RSS and hindu mahasabha fight aginst the mighty british empire? the father of hindutva savarkar cringed before the british for mercy. why was he released by the british from andamaans? why did he cease all anti british/colonialist activities from thereon?

what happens to this"protectors o hindus" when it comes to fighting a strong party like the british empire? why do they pick on weak people alone with rowdies?

do you call this combat ?????? I spit.

All this talk about "sangh parivar for hindus" is pure baloney and fraudulent.

the sangh only wants brahmins to remain dominant and the obc's and dalits to remain subsidary.
some equality....... rofl!

If Salman Rushdie criticized something Islamic, he was banned and exiled from India. When M.F. Hussain abuses Hindu Gods and sensibilities with his mindless paintings the Govt. goes all out to give him 'justice'?

you are a bloody joker. Thackeray, modi are sitting pretty nicely in their homes having carried out pogroms in the past. how shameless and a travesty of justice that is???

what action has been taken against the numerous uncivilised actions of the hindutva garbage?yotally unsatisfactory.

he lose his sleep over 4 million Kashmiris Hindus who have been slaughtered or forced driven out of their homes?

excuse me. these kashmiri hindus" or "palestininean muslims" are not valid humanitarian concerns at all. human empathy has to be driven by compassion and a desire to do good and IRRESPECTIVE OF THE VICTIM'S IDENTITY.

not to promote the sectarian agenda of the sangh or based on sectarian solidarity. is muslim blood any less valuable than hindu blood? os is a christian blood any less valuable than muslim blood?

you are proving yourself to be a sicko by discriminating victims and dead bodies as hindus and muslims. shove your crocodile tears up your you know where.

you and your henchmen are just communalists,ignoramus. you just share a racist ideology.

whether communalists are hindu or muslim or christianor jew is immaterial; you ALL are disagreeable human beings with a twisted worldview and a stupiddity that knows no bounds.

Bloody fool. I never mentioned Sangh Parivaar anywhere merely presented an analysis of what is wrong in the country and why Hindu fundamentalism is on a rise. I am not a comunalist anymore than the likes of Karuna, Congress are Secularist. Truth is whole system is communal. if it is not about Hindu-Muslim than it is about caste and until everyone is treated on economic parity this will be the case. Try reading what is being written before jumping to assumptions. The whole point was that Govt is willing to absolve terrorists from a particular religion and does nothing to stop terrorism because it needs this communal politics to survive. That is the sad truth. Since partition various Govt.s have fed off this deep mistrust between the two majority communities and used it to alienate Muslims and create the so called Hindu bogey to divide and rule and what we have sown, we have finally reaped. The same Congress Govt. led India for 50 years and did nothing to bring muslims in the mainstream and are now playing blame game with Hindus. That is the crux of the current situation. I merely analysed the finer points of what has resulted from their actions. Why is it if a Hindu is killed in a mugging it is just another newsbit, but if a Dalit or a Muslim is killed - the Govt and media jump to yell "Dalit killed', "Muslim Killed". A deliberate attempt is always created to make Hindus look responsible somehow and the line of distrust are dug that much deep. Why is parity not given to the way Govt and media react to everything without looking through the prism of caste/religion? The fact is that is what they want and that is what was given to the people.

Bradman wrote:Can you still be a martyr if you're dragged kicking and screaming to the wooden post after exhausting all avenues avaailable to you under the infidel's law?

ouch

Good posts by trident.

And Vikas, I couldn't care less about the Congress. I know about the sikh riots because a part of my family spent a terrifying night as they saw Delhi burn. So posts about what the congress have done or not done doesn't really cut the mustard with me wrt to Gujarat and the recent Christian killings.

doremi wrote:Good posts by trident.

And Vikas, I couldn't care less about the Congress. I know about the sikh riots because a part of my family spent a terrifying night as they saw Delhi burn. So posts about what the congress have done or not done doesn't really cut the mustard with me wrt to Gujarat and the recent Christian killings.

It should because a we are NOT a Secular country unfortunately and everyone is NOT treated equally. Which is why the incoming civil war will never be wished away. A large part of it can be blamed at the doorstep of one political party who had 50 years to shape a democracy and to promote true equality. Then we would NOT have had so many caste issues. The politicians have NOT removed the caste system after democracy. They have actually HEIGHTENED it for their own selfish powerquest. Nuff said. The decades of mistrust and bad blood could have been avoided if true democracy had been followed based on principles of justice and equality. But that will never be the case now. Trident's views are mere idealism and have no touch of reality in it. Because the Parliament in India does not do anything that is not weighed in appeasing one community or caste for votes. The polarization is inevitable and self destruction imminent. What the likes of Karuna, Laloo, Amar Singh, Arjun Singh, Sonia Gandhi and Raj Thackrey are trying to achieve is the tip of the iceberg. A catastrophe is round the corner. Another decade is all that is before the volcano finally erupts. We will be nothing more than helpless spectators.

One last and final observation: While the minorities have all the rights of equality it cannot be at the expense of the majority community. It is not for the Hindu community alone to be tolerant and patient and expected to be accomodative all the time. Nowhere in the world does this happen. Neither in Islamic majority countries nor in Christianity dominated countries. A section of people do not get excessive attention and exclusive righst over others simply because they are in a 'minority'. It is the responsibility of both such communities to maintain the balance and peace.