Ponting: how bad is he?

It is easy to criticise from one's vantage point on the recliner.

Logic and humility should lead me to think it is ridiculous that someone like me, who has not played organised competitive cricket for twenty years, should be able to find fault with someone who has risen to the very top of the profession.

There are always cases where a captain will make a risky or dubious decision that ends in failure, and we could all in retrospect name mistakes made by Border, Taylor and Waugh.

But so very often, in real-time rather than retrospect, I am wondering why Ponting is setting a defensive field when an attacking one appears to be required, or vice versa. Why successful strike bowlers are left waiting when new batsmen are at the crease, and part timers are brought on, letting the newcomers have a few easy overs to get their eye in.

I mean I suppose it is good to try things and if it works you end up looking like a genius, but if it repeatedly doesn't work you just look like a dill. Does he just get desperate when things start going wrong?

Is it really possible that I know more about captaining a Test side than Ponting does? On one hand it seems impossible, on the other hand the evidence is mounting.

He is the outstanding international batsman of the last five years, bar not even Shiv or Tendy.

As should probably be clear from my first post, I am talking about his captaincy.

I know, but all in all, armchair posters sometimes forget too easily what he has done for Oz with the bat amid all the frothing at the mouth, unAustralian dragging up of a problem with drink in the past, and general intellectual rubbishing of the man for his skippering shortcomings.

So I was just arguing for a bit of perspective from others, as you suggest in your opening.

And I am joshing.

Okay.

But I'm not.

I want to know whether or not other Flaming Bailers think that it is really true that Ponting knows less about captaining a Test side than the average no-name cricketer.

OP, you have us on the horns of a dilemma . . . if we bag Punter, we praise you by default . . .

I'd have to say Ponting is a bit thick when it comes to captaincy. Even with the 2 GMs at his disposal in Ashes 05, his captaincy was infuriatingly one-dimensional and totally lacking in insight. It has been exposed in spades since the departure of the 2 greats.

Tubby should pull him aside and give him some tips.

Okay, not just me. The posts in the Aust match threads are full of criticisms of what Ponting is doing, as he is doing it. Such criticisms are not usually made to look foolish by Ponting's success.

Is he a worse captain than the Flaming Bails brains trust? If so, how can this be? Doesn't he get advice? Doesn't he listen to it?

hmmn..he does not seem wildly imaginative in field setting or deployment of bowlers...but then again he has no champs at his disposal..

personally I think he does a reasonable job...regardless of the result in Sydney, he actually seemed to be enjoying himself more...maybe having a few younger players in the team helped..

Unlike taylor, benaud, chappelli who were natural captains, captaincy and leadership seem hard work for Ponting...he seems to be diligent however and has reaped some reward for that

Would Australia be a better side with someone else (still playing or newly retired) as Captain? .....only if the someone else was SKW

Could Ponting be a better captain? ...Yes

Would he be better if he took his advice from the Ozzies on FB? ...Yes ...as long as it's not Horrie's or Red's advice

OP, don't think Punter is absolutley shite, but he is a bit indecisive. The main problem is that the plans he implements are put together by Neilsen (who is a complete hack) . . . and when they don't work out (which is becoming the case more often than not because we lack the bowling firepower), there aren't many options . . .

Not many captians have had to deal with the retirement of so many great players together with injuries to their probable replacements . . . this has exacerbated Punter's natural obtuseness . . .

tac wrote:OP, don't think Punter is absolutley shite, but he is a bit indecisive. The main problem is that the plans he implements are put together by Neilsen (who is a complete hack) . . . and when they don't work out (which is becoming the case more often than not because we lack the bowling firepower), there aren't many options . . .

Not many captians have had to deal with the retirement of so many great players together with injuries to their probable replacements . . . this has exacerbated Punter's natural obtuseness . . .

But how often did we scream "FFS, try Pup or Fleas" at the TV during the summer? That last day effort in Perth was just abysmal. It was clear we needed wickets but he just kept plugging away with the same boring Nielsen plan.

He's not the worst captain ever, he's just far worse than his record suggests. Without the tgms he'd have an average record as a captain, as it stands his record is superb (despite losing the ashes) but he's very very far away from being in the top 10 captains of all time, despite what the stats may suggest.

fleas has a sore shoulder and was unable to bowl...the injury/illness prone Kid can only be bowled in short spells...

he was let down by the specialist bowlers ...SiddyVic for one has been fiercely critical of his own performance in Perth

horace wrote:fleas has a sore shoulder and was unable to bowl...the injury/illness prone Kid can only be bowled in short spells...

he was let down by the specialist bowlers ...SiddyVic for one has been fiercely critical of his own performance in Perth

Yep, skull, what horrie said. Also it seems a bit silly offering up Pup and fleas as an answer to our lack of bowling firepower, eh?

horace wrote:fleas has a sore shoulder and was unable to bowl...the injury/illness prone Kid can only be bowled in short spells...

he was let down by the specialist bowlers ...SiddyVic for one has been fiercely critical of his own performance in Perth

Hmm, a rare well reasoned and researched post by h (if the facts are correct - hadn't heard that Fleas has a sore shoulder).

Well done, old bean. Keep up the good work.

gggrrr@hildy

heard the fleas stuff on the abc several times

horace wrote:heard the fleas stuff on the abc several times

I don't listen to the ABC much.

It was never mentioned in the Nien commentary box all summer. In fact they themselves kept saying "why isn't Drunky trying Fleas for a few overs".

skully wrote:

horace wrote:heard the fleas stuff on the abc several times

I don't listen to the ABC much.

It was never mentioned in the Nien commentary box all summer. In fact they themselves kept saying "why isn't Drunky trying Fleas for a few overs".

that'll learn ya for watching and listening to nein...came out in the melb test

"Would Australia be a better side with someone else (still playing or newly retired) as Captain? .....only if the someone else was SKW"

Agree.

I don't really want a change of captain. I want RP to listen to people like Border and Taylor.

Well, you'd think that a bunch of influential ex-Test cricketers would have easy access to the likes of Drunky and could've just asked "why aren't you trying Fleas?".

I haven't even mentioned the over rates debacle. That stuff was just stupid.

Straw that broke the camel's back for many of us, OP.

As well as lacking tactical skills. He lacks simple leadership and motivation skills and he is not a diplomat as an international captain should be.