Re: Flaming Bails Selectors Thread - Ashes 3rd Test

by Henry Fri 10 Dec 2010, 22:40

So 10 spinners since Warne, but i'm pretty sure there was an 11th and almost a 12th as Steve O'Keefe played a T20 game against Pakistan earlier this year, and John Holland also toured India with the jamodi side a couple of years ago without actually playing a game.

by Nath Fri 10 Dec 2010, 23:10

Henry wrote:So 10 spinners since Warne, but i'm pretty sure there was an 11th and almost a 12th as Steve O'Keefe played a T20 game against Pakistan earlier this year, and John Holland also toured India with the jamodi side a couple of years ago without actually playing a game.

we're talking Tests, not rubbish cricket

by embee Sat 11 Dec 2010, 01:32

Henry wrote:So 10 spinners since Warne, but i'm pretty sure there was an 11th and almost a 12th as Steve O'Keefe played a T20 game against Pakistan earlier this year, and John Holland also toured India with the jamodi side a couple of years ago without actually playing a game.

You can add Dan Cullen who played vs the Bangers when TGM was still playing but who has since disappeared (which is a worry for someone living in Soz)

by embee Sat 11 Dec 2010, 01:36

Player Span Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10
NM Hauritz 2008-2010 16 31 673.0 139 2101 58 5/53 6/126 36.22 3.12 69.6 2 0
MJ North 2009-2010 21 19 209.4 37 591 14 6/55 6/55 42.21 2.81 89.8 1 0
MJ Clarke 2007-2010 39 31 237.2 41 681 13 3/5 3/33 52.38 2.86 109.5 0 0
JJ Krejza 2008-2008 2 4 123.5 8 562 13 8/215 12/358 43.23 4.53 57.1 1 1
SCG MacGill 2007-2008 4 8 171.0 21 651 10 2/43 4/143 65.10 3.80 102.6 0 0
SM Katich 2008-2010 33 12 63.2 11 229 9 3/34 3/44 25.44 3.61 42.2 0 0
GB Hogg 2007-2008 3 6 125.0 15 481 8 2/51 4/133 60.12 3.84 93.7 0 0
CL White 2008-2008 4 8 93.0 8 342 5 2/71 3/119 68.40 3.67 111.6 0 0
B Casson 2008-2008 1 2 32.0 4 129 3 3/86 3/129 43.00 4.03 64.0 0 0
XJ Doherty 2010-2010 2 3 75.5 11 306 3 2/41 2/148 102.00 4.03 151.6 0 0
SPD Smith 2010-2010 2 3 31.0 7 82 3 3/51 3/51 27.33 2.64 62.0 0 0
BE McGain 2009-2009 1 1 18.0 2 149 0 - - - 8.27 - 0

by Henry Sat 11 Dec 2010, 01:46

So who HASN'T been picked yet? There's that leggie up in Queensland who Warnie rates highly, Cullen Bailey in South Australia, I think NSW has another young leggie in their squad this season. Can't remember his name, though.....

All likely to be picked in the next 12 months?

by lardbucket Sat 11 Dec 2010, 12:04

Who hasn't been picked?

Aaron Heal. Chris Boyce. Dan Harris. Aaron O'Brien. Mark Higgs. Greg Matthews. Shannon Tubb. Chris Simpson. ? Dolan.

by Nath Sat 11 Dec 2010, 21:40

Josh Mangan. Who are those young NSW u/21 spinners? Luke Doran and Adam Zampa or something? Ryan LeLoux

by Henry Sat 11 Dec 2010, 23:08

There seems to be plenty of spinners in Aus. It's just that the majority of them are rubbish. It's as if a bowler only has to show a little bit of promise in his junior years to be fast tracked straight to higher honours, rather than actually putting performances on the board.

I should know. Kerry O'Keefe, Greg Matthews, and Shane Lee saw me bowl my chinamens when I was 13, and told me I was a certainty to play for NSW. By the time I was 17 i'd given up the chinamen for medium pace.

by beamer Sat 11 Dec 2010, 23:40

Henry wrote:There seems to be plenty of spinners in Aus. It's just that the majority of them are rubbish. It's as if a bowler only has to show a little bit of promise in his junior years to be fast tracked straight to higher honours, rather than actually putting performances on the board.

It's an interesting question for any cricketing nation, to fast-track young players before they are ready, or leave them to develop or perhaps stagnate in domestic cricket?

If Sachin Tendulkar had been English or Australian, would he have had to wait until he was in his mid to late 20s to be picked? On the other hand, what about that (supposedly) 14-year-old who Pakistan picked for a Test, he vanished without trace. How would Graeme Swann have got on had he been given an opportunity 5 years earlier?

I guess it varies depending on the player, I've always believed England aren't brave enough in picking young players, except when they are forced into it (see Cook 2005) and if you leave players until they are pushing 30 the chances are they have settled into the county comfort zone and picked up too many bad habits to make it at the top level. Although I suppose Swann and Trott are proving an exception to that rule.

by Henry Sat 11 Dec 2010, 23:57

f you leave players until they are pushing 30 the chances are they have settled into the county comfort zone and picked up too many bad habits to make it at the top level. Although I suppose Swann and Trott are proving an exception to that rule.

And Strauss, who had seven years of County Cricket behind him before he made his England debut. Like you said, it's different for each player. Some players are just destined to reach the top at an early age, ala Tendulkar, Ponting, and Bell. Others plug away, put performances on the board consistently, and leave the selectors with no choice but to pick them (Hussey etc).

Most often when a player is picked very young, he has a brief immediate high, before a fall, a re-assessment, and then comes back for a longer, more sustained high. Ponting was a classic example of this- Gifted youth, thrust into international cricket, did well straight away, then things went wrong, was dropped, came back a better player and more mature person. Swanny could have been like that, but Fletcher saw that he wasn't ready yet from the moment he saw him train for the first time. Unfortunately when Swanny WAS ready Fletcher couldn't forget the 1999 tour of South Africa, so he was left out of the England side for longer than he probably should have been (He had been producing excellence at County level since 2004.)

Even Warne was picked, dropped, then picked again.

by Zat Sun 12 Dec 2010, 03:59

Henry wrote:Kerry O'Keefe, Greg Matthews, and Shane Lee saw me bowl my chinamens when I was 13, and told me I was a certainty to play for NSW. By the time I was 17 i'd given up the chinamen for medium pace.

That was so you couldn't be picked for NSW, and thus ruled out any future chance of you being picked to play for the country you live in, but despise, right?

by Mick Sawyer Sun 12 Dec 2010, 09:56

JGK wrote:And North.

I don't like the thought of Siddle, Harris, MILF and Watto - all RH same.

There are stronger, more telling similarities between Johnson, Bollinger & Siddle.

They are all bowling gunbarrell & would struggle to take a bag in a Shield game.

by embee Sun 12 Dec 2010, 13:46

I think youre over rating Shield batsmen

Johnson 9@ 23.67 BB 5/35
Siddle 13@23.3 BB 4/30
Bollinger 6@16.33 BB 3/25

by Lara Lara Laughs Sun 12 Dec 2010, 14:37

What's the deal with this Smith character then? Can anyone dish the dirt? What is he for a start? Bits and pieces player or something more?

by Gary 111 Sun 12 Dec 2010, 15:33

Interesting. Of the 7 Aussie posters who selected their teams (and some picked XV's rather than Xi's) there were 28 players chosen. No one had gone for Beer, no one had chosen Smith and only 1 person went for Hughes.

by embee Sun 12 Dec 2010, 16:03

Lara Lara Laughs wrote:What's the deal with this Smith character then? Can anyone dish the dirt? What is he for a start? Bits and pieces player or something more?

Young Dubber

Bowls leg spin ...bats a bit ...needs time to develop both to Test standard ...good fielder

Not good enough (yet) to bat at 6 (and neither is Haddin if they bat Smith at 7) ...waste of time playing him on the WACA as a bowler

by embee Sun 12 Dec 2010, 16:07

Gary 111 wrote:Interesting. Of the 7 Aussie posters who selected their teams (and some picked XV's rather than Xi's) there were 28 players chosen. No one had gone for Beer, no one had chosen Smith and only 1 person went for Hughes.

That's because we all know that ...Beer is too inexperienced ...Smith's bowling will be slaughtered on the WACA (TGM's was most Tests there) and his batting isnt worthy of a top 6 place ...and the Poms have Hughes "worked out" ...

.and lastly but definitely not least

The Oz NSP are a bunch of farquits

by Paul Keating Sun 12 Dec 2010, 22:43

Poll in today's SMH on whether to sack Hildick or not

After 2600 votes, 93% say yes.

by horace Sun 12 Dec 2010, 23:08

hmmnn...I am concerned about the 7% who do not believe he should be sacked

by embee Sun 12 Dec 2010, 23:18

horace wrote:hmmnn...I am concerned about the 7% who do not believe he should be sacked

It just proves the Hildick family have internet access

by PeterCS Sun 12 Dec 2010, 23:19

Ah, but you see it wasn't at all representative. They only asked those who used monikers like "Mr Angry".

Most Aussie supporters are cool with A Hilditch. In many cases, it's close to love.

by Nath Mon 13 Dec 2010, 01:04

horace wrote:hmmnn...I am concerned about the 7% who do not believe he should be sacked

the 7% probably don't know who he is

by horace Mon 13 Dec 2010, 02:21

embee wrote:
horace wrote:hmmnn...I am concerned about the 7% who do not believe he should be sacked

It just proves the Hildick family have internet access

hmnn...I can picture simmo thumping out on the keys in a desparate attempt to maintain his influence over the perfidy that is Australian cricket

by Zat Mon 13 Dec 2010, 02:28

Disturbing that I first read horrie's comment as I can picture simmo humping out on the keys

by skully Mon 13 Dec 2010, 10:32

skully wrote:
JGK wrote:Great stuff from Junior on Inside BJ last night - I am sure he reads this forum...

Brendan Julian “So where do we go from here boys, Junior what do you reckon?”

Mark Waugh “Mate if I was a selector there are at least five, maybe six, of those blokes who’d be looking for something to do next week, because they wouldn’t be playing cricket in Perth.”

Damien Fleming “Such as?”

Waugh “Mate, Doherty for a start. I mean jeez, we’ve picked a bloke because we don’t know who our spinner should be. Should we seriously pick a guy who has played 10 state level tests in his life to go up against Pietersen, Cooke and those guys?”

Julian “Bit harsh”

Waugh “Bit harsh? He was chucking that many pies at Pietersen he may as well have opened a bakery on days 2 and 3.”

Fleming “North?”

Waugh “Gone”

Julian “Bollinger? Siddle?”

Waugh “Gone”

Gladstone Small “ Can I interrupt for a minute?”

Waugh “No”

Julian “Junior is on a bit of a roll here Stone”

Waugh “No I mean fair go, we’ve got it wrong here. If I’m the only bloke not happy that we’ve been rolled for an innings and 70 odd runs on a runway of a pitch and that lets be honest we’re going to have a summer of the poms handing us our ars&s in this series then fair go boys, something’s wrong here. What’s Clarke doing after getting out? He’s on twitter saying sorry for not walking? Mate if he did that in our side there’d be hell to play. AB would chuck his twitter box off the balcony or whatever it is. Sorry for not walking? Jesus christ man."

Did he really say all that? Farkin Gold if he did. Sorry I missed it.

"AB would chuck his twitter box off the balcony or whatever it is."

Turns out this was viral bullsh!t. On Inside BJ tonight, it was cleared up that, while many of MEW's mates gave him a wrap, he did not actually say any of the above.

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