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Benazir Bhutto assassinated!

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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 05:16

filosofee wrote:The doctors, in the hospital where Bhutto was treated, are silent? Wonder why!

The doctors would be safe if Benazir died immediately, so the obvious cause of death would be the firing/blast.

I can imagine what will happen if resuscitation of BB went well and she lived for a day more before succumbing to the massive shock of both the bullet wounds + thoracotomy.... the crowd would be baying for the blood of the doctors.

no post mortem was done. there is no question of exhuming the body now to find the truth.
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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 05:29

Benazir aide says govt explanation ‘pack of lies’

ISLAMABAD, Dec 28: A top aide to slain opposition leader Benazir Bhutto on Friday rejected the government’s explanation of her death as a “pack of lies”.

The Pakistan interior ministry said Ms Bhutto died when she hit her head on her vehicle’s sunroof as she ducked after a gun and suicide attack on a campaign rally, and that no bullets or shrapnel were found in her.

“It is baseless. It is a pack of lies,” Farooq Naik, Ms Bhutto’s top lawyer and a senior official in her Pakistan People’s Party, told AFP.

Two bullets hit her, one in the abdomen and one in the head,” Mr Naik said. “Bhutto’s personal secretary Naheed Khan and party official Makhdoom Amin Fahim were in the car and they saw what happened,” he said.

“It is an irreparable loss and they are turning it into a joke with such claims. The country is heading towards civil war.” Interior ministry spokesman Javed Cheema said earlier that the post-mortem on the populist opposition leader found her mortal wound came when she tried to duck after the bomber attacked.

“The government is now claiming that Baitullah Mehsud is responsible,” Mr Naik told AFP. “What is the evidence?”

He added: “She was taken to hospital. She was bleeding. It was a serious security lapse.”—AFP
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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 05:33

So snipers shot her using armor-piercing rounds. And the doctors killled her under guise of treatment and thoracotomy. Bullets in abdomen will confirm that it is either armour piercing bullets, confirming army's involvement or someone shooting from inside the SUV, which means someone close to BB is involved in the assassination.



the streets were immidiately hosed down by fire dept to wash away traces of any evidence. this is a military/ISI operation backed by US CIA/MI6
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Post by lardbucket Sat 29 Dec 2007, 06:14

all I can hear is blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

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Post by The One Sat 29 Dec 2007, 07:12

benazir's death, nawaz's exclusion and musharraf's lack of army clothing is quite likely to take pakistan to civil war. sindh is boiling and many are looking for seperation and so too in balochistan (not mentioning parts where the pakistanis have no control over already). one hopes the army can keep the country together till it stabilises a bit or else the chances of a nuke falling on our cities will go up manifold. the pakistani establishment has a clear policy of nuking india if any country invades and also if pakistan is seen to fall apart. add in the risk of some mullahs getting a bomb or two and we have a very scary scenario for india over the coming decade

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Post by doremi Sat 29 Dec 2007, 07:50

Yeah, as someone said in an interview in a news channel, we must be way up high in their list of places to be nuked. Second after the US?
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Post by The One Sat 29 Dec 2007, 08:02

india would be first. the us is not possible with pak technology

besides if its a pakistani pressing that button you can be sure its going to hit bombay and delhi first

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Post by Henry Sat 29 Dec 2007, 08:11

And then India manage to get their missiles away before the one's from Pakistan hit, and that, as they say, is that.
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Post by The One Sat 29 Dec 2007, 08:23

before or after doesnt matter. pakistan will be finished, so will a few of india's biggest cities and the world will have a nuclear winter

the nukes in pakistan are the biggest worry for me. with the country almost breaking up its only a matter of time and theres nothing anyone can do about it. the international community has a lot to answer for, esp the americans, the europeans and the chinese

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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 08:41

Benazir was shot in the abdomen.

She was sitting in an semi-armored bullet proof SUV.

This means a high calibre armor-penetrating bullet had been used in killing her.

This also points towards a military sniper and bullets above .50 calibre which are military grade.

Considering how just her head and part of her chest were exposed outside the sunroof.

Thus one can conclude that the military of pakistan is squarely responsible for bumping off Benazir.

Also considering the haste with which the scene of crime was hosed down with high pressure fire hoses points clearly to complicity of the military Govt of pakistan behind the act.

The military that has pulled off this act on a leading politician of Pakistan is in control of that country and its nukes.

So it's business as usual.
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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 08:49

url(Huffington Post)


Benazir Bhutto assassinated! - Page 3 Slide_72_0

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Benazir Bhutto assassinated! - Page 3 Slide_72_2

Benazir Bhutto assassinated! - Page 3 Slide_72_3
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Post by eowyn Sat 29 Dec 2007, 10:47

buckaroo, you are be the pale.
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Post by Allan D Sat 29 Dec 2007, 13:46

I think the conspiracy theories are closer to that of Princess Diana than JFK with Musharraf in the role of Prince Phillip. If armour-piercing bullets were used they would have blown Bhutto's head off as well as caused death or serious injury to the others in the car (who were by all accounts uninjured). If the military were involved why would they use a suicide bomber? The military is the most secular institution in Pakistan and I cannot see how they could find a volunteer who was both an expert marksman and willing to blow himself up.

Secondly, who gains? Certainly not Musharraf who was already in a weak position before the assassination. Bhutto clearly had the West's backing and her return to Pakistan and the holding of elections were both due to US pressure. If the Americans even suspected Musharraf's involvement (or even that of the Pakistani military unregulated by MusharraF) his ass would not have the chance to hit the door on the way out.

The only gainers, according to their perverted logic, from thwarting the democratic process and plunging Pakistan into chaos must be A-Q. Besides Bhutto represented everything they hate. She was pro-western, female and a Shi'a.
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Post by *Buckaroo* Sat 29 Dec 2007, 14:55

Allan D wrote:I think the conspiracy theories are closer to that of Princess Diana than JFK with Musharraf in the role of Prince Phillip. If armour-piercing bullets were used they would have blown Bhutto's head off as well as caused death or serious injury to the others in the car (who were by all accounts uninjured). (Hello, Benazir's closest security guard, the one in the car died in the attack, and the armor-piercing round was used only to target her part protected by the SUV, apparently they didn't want to take any chances this time. The last time round when she was attacked the Indian Intelligence agency RAW had warned her of an impending attack and which made her scurry into the protected truck she was travelling in just in the nick of time which saved her life from the snipers

The similarity is not with Princess Diana but closer home in Pakistan itself there was some similarity to what happened in the attack on the Karachi Corps Commander in 2004. There too marksmen were employed. The gun attack was followed by a bomb attack and the snipers escaped. They did that in the high security Clifton area near the US Embassy. Obviously, there was a lot of internal help there as well, probably from renegade elements in the ISI, Pakistan Army and the Police. Mehsud, distancing himself from the assassination, could lend credence to the theory of the 'establishment' doing this. Benign support or even positive egging on could have come from Musharraf and his political friends.
) If the military were involved why would they use a suicide bomber? The military is the most secular institution in Pakistan*and I cannot see how they could find a volunteer who was both an expert marksman and willing to blow himself up.

Secondly, who gains? Certainly not Musharraf who was already in a weak position before the assassination. Bhutto clearly had the West's backing and her return to Pakistan and the holding of elections were both due to US pressure. If the Americans even suspected Musharraf's involvement (or even that of the Pakistani military unregulated by MusharraF) his ass would not have the chance to hit the door on the way out.

The only gainers, according to their perverted logic, from thwarting the democratic process and plunging Pakistan into chaos must be A-Q. Besides Bhutto represented everything they hate. She was pro-western, female and a Shi'a.
*you have lot to learn.
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Post by Allan D Sat 29 Dec 2007, 16:27

"If the army was not secular, there would be a lack of support for President Musharraf within their ranks. Musharraf has separated religion from politics while allowing religious parties to co-exist in the formation of a new government. Proof that there is a move away from Islamisation to secularism within the army is the 'Beard Count' and the fact that there are several forward thinking officers within the ranks. "

Link

The Pakistan Army provides a technical education for all its recruits and to some extent remedies the deficiencies of the general education system. No officer can get through staff college without a technical expertise and a fluency in English. A thorough knowledge of the Qu'ran simply won't cut it and will act as a bar to promotion as overly-devout officers are prevented from taking up the most sensitive commands. This competence is probably the reason that Pakistan has made its biggest economic and social progress (especially in areas such as women's rights) during periods of military rule (including the Musharraf period).
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Post by Lara Lara Laughs Sat 29 Dec 2007, 17:39

Sorry about the spelling. Fixed now.

Re: Bhutto's corruption - As far as I can tell nothing was ever proven, was it?
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Post by Allan D Sat 29 Dec 2007, 18:06

Not according to this:

"On August 6, 2003, Swiss magistrates found Bhutto and her husband guilty of money laundering. They were given six-month suspended jail terms, fined $50,000 each and were ordered to pay $11 million to the Pakistani government. The six-year trial concluded that Bhutto and Zardari deposited in Swiss accounts $10 million given to them by a Swiss company in exchange for a contract in Pakistan. The couple said they would appeal. The Pakistani investigators say Zardari opened a Citibank account in Geneva in 1995 through which they say he passed some $40 million of the $100 million he received in payoffs from foreign companies doing business in Pakistan."


Link
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Post by noelene Sun 30 Dec 2007, 11:55

She must have cared a lot for the country to put herself at risk like that.
She planned her burial and left letters for her family and friends.
A love of money would not lead to those actions.If she had stayed in exile,Pakistan
may have been better off.Her death has only harmed the country more.

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Post by *Buckaroo* Sun 30 Dec 2007, 15:26

December 28, 2007
http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index1060.htm
Sniper Teams Kill Pakistan’s Bhutto Prior To Meeting US Lawmakers

By: Sorcha Faal, and as reported to her Western Subscribers

FSB reports presented to President Putin on the assassination of Pakistan opposition leader Benazir Bhutto [pictured top-left 30 seconds before death] today are detailing what Russian Security Analysts are stating was a ‘sophisticated’ sniper team attack which left the loved leader of her people dead.

These reports state Pakistan’s elite commando division, called the Special Service Group (SSG), and which is the elite special operations arm of the Pakistani Army, were ‘most likely’ to blame as they are the only organization capable of mounting an operation such as this in Pakistan.

[b]As to the actual assassination of Bhutto these reports state that she was fired upon by ‘no less’ than 3 separate sniper teams firing in excess of 6 times [India sources say 5]and which was then followed by 2 ‘simultaneous’ rocket propelled grenades designed to destroy the scene of the assassination, but whose explosions could then be ‘blamed’ on a ‘suicide bombing'.

Russian Military Analysts are further reporting that the assassination of Bhutto, by Pakistan’s Military Forces, was necessitated due to her imminent meeting with two top US Lawmakers, US Congressman Patrick Kennedy and US Senator Arlen Specter, who she was scheduled to meet following her last rally, and where she was prepared to give Mr. Kennedy and Mr. Specter ‘evidence’ that supported her claims that she was being targeted for death by Pakistan’s US backed dictator Pervez Musharraf.

It is important to note that Benazir Bhutto had previously stated to the US that she would only turn her evidence over to Congressman Kennedy and Senator Specter due to their involvement with the assassination of the American President John F. Kennedy in 1963 as Patrick Kennedy is a surviving family member and Arlen Specter was the chief investigator of the President’s murder for the Warren Commission, the tribunal set up to investigate President Kennedy’s killing.

It was, state these reports, Bhutto’s belief that only two such prominent lawmakers who knew the ‘truth’ behind the assassination of President Kennedy could properly handle the ‘shocking’ information she was prepared to present to them should she have lived but one more hour.

Also, it is important to note that occurring during the same time frame as the plot and killing of Bhutto in Pakistan, its US ally began suffering a series of bizarre attacks against its War Leaders, and which included the United States Army Leader, Secretary Pete Geren, having his home in Texas targeted by a suicidal driver, and, also in Texas, the childhood home of President Bush, and which is on the property of his fathers Presidential Museum, being attacked by arsonists.

These current events, and when coupled with the White House attack that left Vice President Cheney’s offices in flames, and which we had previously reported on, point towards a growing destabilization of the current World Order due to the United States continued efforts to gain hegemony over the vital oil resources of the Middle East, but which these latest events may prove to be much harder now to accomplish.

This is so, and as these reports make clear, the United States complicity with Pakistan to ‘create and control’ the very terrorist organizations they have used to mislead their peoples into giving up their freedoms and support a World War that is bankrupting the United States due to the truth that the truest enemies of the West are their very own leaders.
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Post by filosofee Sun 30 Dec 2007, 20:37

noelene wrote:She must have cared a lot for the country to put herself at risk like that.
She planned her burial and left letters for her family and friends.
A love of money would not lead to those actions.If she had stayed in exile,Pakistan
may have been better off.Her death has only harmed the country more.

Doesn't seem to have harmed her husband shamefully thrusting forth their nineteen year-old son, taking law at Oxford, as the heir apparent. Maybe Bilawal, who has now adorned the Bhutto suffix to lead the PPP, should take note of this:

AS long as Pakistan chooses to remain a serf state, a vassal of the powers that sustain it, both from West and East, it will be a nation of ‘subcontinental monkeys’ who have yet to lose their tails and climb down from the high trees.

How long will this country remain subservient to those who can reason and think?

Who engineered the killing of Benazir Bhutto? Apart from her own quest for power, it can safely and with emphasis be said that it was the rulers of the western world, the governments of George W. Bush of the USA, and of firstly Tony Blair and then of Gordon Brown of the United Kingdom. It was their global policies conjured up to suit their present-day needs and desires, their policy of having ‘no permanent friends’, that dispatched Benazir back to Pakistan and to her doom. This is the unified opinion of their own press and media.

It is perhaps set out most clearly in a Washington Post report of Dec 28 under the heading ‘US brokered Bhutto’s return to Pakistan’. Clear and simple — as it says it. “For Benazir Bhutto, the decision to return to Pakistan was sealed during a telephone call from Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice just a week before Bhutto flew home in October. The call culminated more than a year of secret diplomacy . . .” Rice, reportedly, was only engaged in the final stages of the famous ‘deal’. Her call was made to Benazir in Dubai. “A week later, on October 18, Bhutto returned. Ten weeks later she was dead.

From Dawn: http://www.dawn.com/weekly/cowas/cowas.htm
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Post by lardbucket Sun 30 Dec 2007, 20:59

Amidst all the loony theories and prognostications promulgated by our own resident 'cut and paste' troll, the saddest comment I've heard on this whole affair came from a Pakistani friend of mine here. When asked what she thought would happen in Pakistan as a result, she replied 'Do you know - nothing. Things will go on as before. This sort of thing happens all the time in Pakistan, and besides, in many people's eyes she was just another corrupt politician and not very important".

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Post by filosofee Sun 30 Dec 2007, 21:28

lardbucket wrote:Amidst all the loony theories and prognostications promulgated by our own resident 'cut and paste' troll, the saddest comment I've heard on this whole affair came from a Pakistani friend of mine here. When asked what she thought would happen in Pakistan as a result, she replied 'Do you know - nothing. Things will go on as before. This sort of thing happens all the time in Pakistan, and besides, in many people's eyes she was just another corrupt politician and not very important".

Have to agree with your friend, LB.
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Post by Makaveli Sun 30 Dec 2007, 22:54

Aye me too filo, the same cronies come and go, don't know why the media here are making her out to be some sort of saviour/hero, Pakistan needs something fresh, all this hoo-haa about nukes, civil wars etc is stupid, i'm pretty certain nothing extreme will happen as a result of this.
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Post by Allan D Sun 30 Dec 2007, 23:44

I'm tending to that point of view too as I am beginning to suffer from Bhutto-fatigue. India has survived two political assassinations of the Nehru-Gandhi dynasty (3 if you count M.K.Gandhi - no relation) as well as martial law. Sri Lanka has had a 25-year long civil war and Bangladesh has had a recurrent cocktail of natural disasters from tsunamis to typhoons (interestingly without resort to military governments) yet life still goes on. The deaths of Kennedy and Diana shifted a lot of newsprint but made little difference to the scheme of things. Johnson continued Kennedy's policies whether in regard to civil rights or Vietnam and the Royal Family seem to be as popular as ever (even Camilla has steadily increased her approval ratings).

I remember as a precocious 11yo, having been informed of the murder of JFK, explaining to my parents how the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand had led directly to WWI (my father being convinced that the Russians were behind JFK's death, as payback for being humiliated over the Cuban Missile Crisis the year before) but of course that was all nonsense. WWIII did not break out and my historical analogy was worthless anyway since, thanks to the diligent efforts of the German historian Fritz Fischer, we now know that the German High Command had made up their minds to have a European war in 1914 two years before and that the murder of Franz Ferdinand (and his wife) was an excuse not a reason for war.

Interesting watching Bilawal at the press conference today. He made his statement in English and is not fluent in either Urdu or Sindhi which may be rather a drawback for the leader of a party appealing to the rural poor so obvuiously more revision is called for. He is attending the same college at Oxford as his grandfather did between 1950-53 but seems to be reading PPE (as his mother did at Lady Margaret Hall between 1973-6) rather than law as his grandfather did (and both his mother and grandfather had attended American universities prior to Oxford which Bilawal doesn't appear to have done.

A notable incident occurred during her mother's time at Oxford (where she was known for her party-going rather than her application to her studies). There is a biennial ceremony at Oxford known as Encaenia where there is a solemn procession up the High Street of multi-coloured gowned dignitaries to the Hawksmoor-designed horseshoe-shaped Sheldonian Theatre where the Chancellor bestows honorary degrees on the great and the good who are suitably lauded in Latin beforehand by a figure known as the Public Orator.

The list of honorands is decided by the academic heads of the various component colleges of the university (who are all self-governing) and it usually goes through "on the nod" . However a much larger body, known as Congregation, consisting of all the academics in Oxford has the power to object which had, until this event, been unused (there had been some objections to Harry Truman being given a degree because of the A-bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki but these had been overruled).

However in the mid-1970s Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto's name appeared on the list of prospective honorands. Although then the incumbent Prime Minister of Pakistan there was considerable opposition to his award because of the role he had played in ordering the burning down of Lahore University library during the suppression of student dissent some years earlier. Despite a tragic-looking Ms Bhutto appearing on the front of "The Oxford Mail" in the company of various academics such as the historian Lord Blake, then Provost of Queen's College, pleading her father's cause the opposition proved successful and Bhutto's name was omitted - the first time in the history of the university that this had occurred (Mrs T was to join Z.A.Bhutto in this peculiar blackballing in the 1980s but for different reasons).

This snub by the university doesn't seem to have put off the Bhutto family from continuing to attend it however.
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Post by furriner Mon 31 Dec 2007, 00:02

So Allan D, let me get this right. Oxford gave a honorary degree to Truman despite opposition based on the fact that he ordered Nagasaki and Hiroshima to be nuked. Oxford later on took a historic decision to deny Bhutto a degree based on the contention (I don't know whether it was proved or not) that he played a role in/ ordered the burning of a uni Library?

I am not arguing whether they should or not have given Truman the degree, mind. Just that it seems highly random in comparison.
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