Boycott - what a prick

Geoffrey Trueman wrote:

Naeem wrote:Look at a player like Ab de villiers, a so called great batsman before he even started playing international cricket. He is inconsistent and has a really poor temperament.

Mmm, 9 tests and an average of 49.73 that includes a 381 ball 174 that helped to put SA into a match winning position.

If you don't want him can we have him? You could replace him with Justin Ontong.

This is his last 9 tests?

I thought De Villiers was probably SA's most consistent batsman in the series against England.

How many better 24 year olds do SA have?

JP Duminy (left arm bat)

Stiaan V Zyl (batsman)

Yusuf Abdullah (left arm fast/medium)

Darryn Smit (batsman)

Dean Elgar (batsman)

Heino Kuhn (wk)

Blake Snijman

Lonwabe Tsotsobe (Left arm fast/medium)


Need more?

Naeem wrote:JP Duminy (left arm bat)

Stiaan V Zyl (batsman)

Yusuf Abdullah (left arm fast/medium)

Darryn Smit (batsman)

Dean Elgar (batsman)

Heino Kuhn (wk)

Blake Snijman

Lonwabe Tsotsobe (Left arm fast/medium)


Need more?

Naeem , I trust you are joking?

Not joking.

I dont rate de Villiers as a master-class batsman.

He's over-hyped, gets out way too much in the 90's, and has not proven himself to be a worthy number 6.

I would replace him with JP.

Naeem wrote:Not joking.

I dont rate de Villiers as a master-class batsman.

He's over-hyped, gets out way too much in the 90's, and has not proven himself to be a worthy number 6.

I would replace him with JP.

Well firstly you included bowlers in your analysis.

Remind me what JP did in the latest ODI series again?

Oh, i didnt realise the question was referring to batsmen only.

You saying JP doesnt deserve a test spot? What did AB do prior to being selected to play for SA in tests besides being over-hyped by the media for being the next Jonty?

Even if you look at his career thus far:

He had a great start in 2005 but was totally crap for the next 2 years. Nobody called for his head as he was a youngster and was 'undoubtedly' talented.

But if one of our black brothers doesn't perform for one series ala Prince,Amla,Philander then they are the cause of all our problems.

You have to see that?

By the way - this is nothing personal, im really enjoying the healthy debate.

Naeem wrote:Oh, i didnt realise the question was referring to batsmen only.

You saying JP doesnt deserve a test spot? What did AB do prior to being selected to play for SA in tests besides being over-hyped by the media for being the next Jonty?

Even if you look at his career thus far:

He had a great start in 2005 but was totally crap for the next 2 years. Nobody called for his head as he was a youngster and was 'undoubtedly' talented.

But if one of our black brothers doesn't perform for one series ala Prince,Amla,Philander then they are the cause of all our problems.

You have to see that?

By the way - this is nothing personal, im really enjoying the healthy debate.

Fair enough.

The next Jonty? He was playing as a keeper then?

Actually AB's stats for the past year are pretty good.

No I don't see it. Everytime a "white" saffie criticises a POC the race card is played. As you know I don't rate McLaren but no one calls me a racist. But if I dare to criticise Philander......

My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

In SA there is a raging debate for 'black' and 'white' players.

In India they have this debate for 'North Indian', 'South Indian' ' Indian from West' or Mumbai-ite, Indian from East or Kolkatta.

In Australia you debate about players given undue advantage because they are NSW or players from Tasmania being overlooked etc etc.

Which kind of discrimination is worst?

Any form of discrimination is bad, Chandan. But unfortunately it has existed since the dawn of time and will exist until the Cylons take over.

taipan wrote:

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

If Boeta was black do you think he would have been allowed so many chances for SA?

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

If Boeta was black do you think he would have been allowed so many chances for SA?

Boeta was in and out of the team and his position was changed often.

Was never really given a set position and an extended run.

taipan wrote:

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

If Boeta was black do you think he would have been allowed so many chances for SA?

Boeta was in and out of the team and his position was changed often.

Was never really given a set position and an extended run.

Weren't you hammering philander who was played fewer games in even harder circumstances? I would hate to read your venom if Boeta was black

(Not that I consider you a racist)

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

If Boeta was black do you think he would have been allowed so many chances for SA?

Boeta was in and out of the team and his position was changed often.

Was never really given a set position and an extended run.

Weren't you hammering philander who was played fewer games in even harder circumstances? I would hate to read your venom if Boeta was black

(Not that I consider you a racist)

I hammered Philander because I think he is a shit cricketer.

I have never held a brief for Boeta either. I was responding to your comment that he had been gievn an extended run.

I am record on this board that I would care if the SA team was 100% black as long as they were the best 11 in the country.

If I read your post correctly I am not allowed to criticise Philander on cricekting grounds because I am white?

taipan wrote:

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:

Naeem wrote:My point is that Philander deserves a decent run in ODI's before we criticize him to the extent of him not deserving his place in the side.

We give all the 'white' players a fair go before criticizing, why not give everybody the same chance?

Well since he can't field at all. I am not criticising him because of his colour, but because of his ability.

I think there was a list earlier on this thread of "white" players who were not given an extended run.

If Boeta was black do you think he would have been allowed so many chances for SA?

Boeta was in and out of the team and his position was changed often.

Was never really given a set position and an extended run.

Weren't you hammering philander who was played fewer games in even harder circumstances? I would hate to read your venom if Boeta was black

(Not that I consider you a racist)

I hammered Philander because I think he is a shit cricketer.

I have never held a brief for Boeta either. I was responding to your comment that he had been gievn an extended run.

I am record on this board that I would care if the SA team was 100% black as long as they were the best 11 in the country.

If I read your post correctly I am not allowed to criticise Philander on cricekting grounds because I am white?

I have no problem with criticism of Philander's ability

But didn't you claim Philander got 7 caps merely due to his colour? It's unfortunate that ppl say this whenever a coloured player doesn't make a 100 on debut, whilst claiming Boeta's deserves his 40 caps and launch a passionate, polished defence of him.

It doesn't look very balanced IMO, esp for someone talking about equal rights

Don't quote me wrote:


I have no problem with criticism of Philander's ability

But didn't you claim Philander got 7 caps merely due to his colour? It's unfortunate that ppl say this whenever a coloured player doesn't make a 100 on debut, whilst claiming Boeta's deserves his 40 caps and launch a passionate, polished defence of him.

It doesn't look very balanced IMO, esp for someone talking about equal rights

Ever heard of the quota? Ever seen him play?

Am I criticising Amla, Prince, Gibbs or Ntini.

What defence. I was merely demolishing your idiotic comment about his extended run, Didn't you claim that he had an extended run because he was white?

Frankly you are coming across as the racist here.

taipan wrote:

Don't quote me wrote:


I have no problem with criticism of Philander's ability

But didn't you claim Philander got 7 caps merely due to his colour? It's unfortunate that ppl say this whenever a coloured player doesn't make a 100 on debut, whilst claiming Boeta's deserves his 40 caps and launch a passionate, polished defence of him.

It doesn't look very balanced IMO, esp for someone talking about equal rights

Ever heard of the quota? Ever seen him play?

Am I criticising Amla, Prince, Gibbs or Ntini.

What defence. I was merely demolishing your idiotic comment about his extended run, Didn't you claim that he had an extended run because he was white?

Frankly you are coming across as the racist here.

It's not about Boeta being white, just not "black" IMO
One of the problems that I see is that whenever a "black" player fails this quota talk is brought up. Thus it's harder for a "black" to get the chances that Boeta got.

Seeing you talk about quotas after Philander's 7 games kinda highlights it for me.

As I said earlier I don't think you are rascist, whatever you think of me. But the climate for black players is quite difficult right now. ALso whenever SA lose, the quotas talk is a convenient excuse for many

[quote="Don't quote me"]

taipan wrote:[
It's not about Boeta being white, just not "black" IMO
One of the problems that I see is that whenever a "black" player fails this quota talk is brought up. Thus it's harder for a "black" to get the chances that Boeta got.

Seeing you talk about quotas after Philander's 7 games kinda highlights it for me.

As I said earlier I don't think you are rascist, whatever you think of me. But the climate for black players is quite difficult right now. ALso whenever SA lose, the quotas talk is a convenient excuse for many

That's a different take

Actually it makes it easier for a quota player. E,G, Gibbs, Amla

Have you seen him play provincial cricket? I have.

So why should they be picked on the colour of their skin? Isn't that a form of apartheid?

One last question. Do you regard Philander as an international standard cricketer?

[quote="taipan"]

Don't quote me wrote:

taipan wrote:[
It's not about Boeta being white, just not "black" IMO
One of the problems that I see is that whenever a "black" player fails this quota talk is brought up. Thus it's harder for a "black" to get the chances that Boeta got.

Seeing you talk about quotas after Philander's 7 games kinda highlights it for me.

As I said earlier I don't think you are rascist, whatever you think of me. But the climate for black players is quite difficult right now. ALso whenever SA lose, the quotas talk is a convenient excuse for many

That's a different take

Actually it makes it easier for a quota player. E,G, Gibbs, Amla

Have you seen him play provincial cricket? I have.

So why should they be picked on the colour of their skin? Isn't that a form of apartheid?

One last question. Do you regard Philander as an international standard cricketer?

Have you seen him play provincial cricket? NO
Do you regard Philander as an international standard cricketer? Probably not, can't say for sure due to answer no.1. I wouldn't write him off he hasn't done too badly

I have seen him play in both State, FCC and ODI cricket, and he looks fairly gash to be honest.

I think the problems here are highlighted by both you guys.

1. Quota system does mean that in some instances the SA side that takes the field is certainly not the strongest side they could put out, and that is what rankles with alot of Saffa's.

2. On the other side of the coin, maybe players are regarded as quota picks slightly earlier than they should do, however I think its fairly evident when these players are seen on the International stage that they are. Amla looked to be one of those in his first spell, however he now is a quality player IMO.

holcs wrote:I have seen him play in both State, FCC and ODI cricket, and he looks fairly gash to be honest.

I think the problems here are highlighted by both you guys.

1. Quota system does mean that in some instances the SA side that takes the field is certainly not the strongest side they could put out, and that is what rankles with alot of Saffa's.

2. On the other side of the coin, maybe players are regarded as quota picks slightly earlier than they should do, however I think its fairly evident when these players are seen on the International stage that they are. Amla looked to be one of those in his first spell, however he now is a quality player IMO.

Have to admit I didn't rate Amla at first because of his technique.

He has worked hard on it, but the acid test will come this summer.

Maybe if SA openly stated they were getting rid of the quota system there wouldn't be these arguments. While they have a quota system, underperforming black players will be in the gun because it will be perceived that they're picked on quota basis which is probably unfair because there will always be white players out of form too. But didn't that president guy state that Nel was excluded from the India tour on the basis of his colour for Langeveldt? If this is the case no wonder there is a raging debate about who and who isn't deserving.

From what I've seen of Philander he's definitely not up to standard at this stage which is not to say he won't develop. His fielding is ghastly and he looks to be a bit of a nothing player atm with neither his batting nor bowling looking like they're anything but pedestrian. He's young but I don't know if throwing him to the wolves will help his confidence.

Philander is a shit bowler and fielder. And he really isn't that good a batsman from what I've seen of him. Like a poor man's Mascarenhas.