Re: The EPL thread (II)

[Brass Monkey]

Yeah, Rio's alright at that. He's a gashlord at defending from breakaways though.

[JKLever]

Well, that's exactly my point. It's nothing to do with technique, it's to do with the way we play. The reason we can't keep the ball is because we smack it forward at every opportunity.

And the reason we smack it forward is because of the lack of technique of our defenders - see my point above.

No it's not. That's just untrue. Most of the time ,one of the defenders passes it a Gerrard or a Barry or a Carrick to spray the ball upfield.

Yes, when under no pressure from the opposition

We must be watching different games if you truly believe that English players possess the same level of technique as our counterparts. The way we coach our kids is fooking shocking and I think we've had that discussion before....

[Brass Monkey]

Used to be a commentator for Anglia in the 1980's called Gerry Harrison - best commentator around.

Remember him, yeah he was OK actually. Used to go apeshit when talking about the Cobblers when we were a marauding team full of awesome flair and talent. Ah that one season was good.

For some reason I liked Alan Parry for a bit until I realised he was trying to be a Martin Tyler/Motty hybrid and ended up sounding like a gibbering heap of cactus.

[Lara Lara Laughs]

Yes, and we came to the conclusion that it's the way we play, not the technique, that is the problem. Martin Samuels with his massive pitches, smack the ball forward articles.

[Brass Monkey]

Yes, when under no pressure from the opposition

We must be watching different games if you truly believe that English players possess the same level of technique as our counterparts. The way we coach our kids is fooking shocking and I think we've had that discussion before....

I agreed and disagreed to some extents with you too. Thought I put my points across well. You didn't give me enough lovin' for it.

[Lara Lara Laughs]

And you keep changing your story. First you were saying that our team didn't have technique or talent. Then you said they can't pass or control the ball. Now you've decidedn upon "our defenders" and general "technique".

If you seriously think that Gerrard or Lampard can't pass the ball, or control the ball as well as a player from any other country, then you're deluded.

[JKLever]

Yeah, Rio's alright at that.

And thats the problem, Rio is held up as some shining example and yet he's one of the very few English players who can bring the ball out.

I watched the Spurs/United game and Michael Dawson is a prime example of one of our players with ordinary technique. He can pass when unchallenged but under pressure he just kept wacking it up the pitch to no-one much to the groans of the yids fans.

[Brass Monkey]

Yeah, Rio's alright at that.

And thats the problem, Rio is held up as some shining example and yet he's one of the very few English players who can bring the ball out.

I watched the Spurs/United game and Michael Dawson is a prime example of one of our players with ordinary technique. He can pass when unchallenged but under pressure he just kept wacking it up the pitch to no-one much to the groans of the yids fans.

I'm not a Rio fan. I'm not a Dawson fan. They can both fook off. But yeah, if in doubt HOOOOOFFFF!!!!!

[Henry]

Didn't watch the game.....Good win? Those Swiss are no pushovers. I guess English football is well and truly back on track then?......

[Lara Lara Laughs]

Ledley King can do it too. Woodgate is good at it. Curtis Davies looks like he could.

[Brass Monkey]

Didn't watch the game.....Good win? Those Swiss are no pushovers. I guess English football is well and truly back on track then?......

Hah. No. The Swiss are ordinary anyway. Well organised, but immensely ordinary.

[Brass Monkey]

Ledley King can do it too. Woodgate is good at it. Curtis Davies looks like he could.

Nah, dey is both gash under presh IMO. Wood is a good reader of the game, but a bit lightweight and gets bustled too much, can't take it out for shit.

[spangler]

And you keep changing your story. First you were saying that our team didn't have technique or talent. Then you said they can't pass or control the ball. Now you've decidedn upon "our defenders" and general "technique".

If you seriously think that Gerrard or Lampard can't pass the ball, or control the ball as well as a player from any other country, then you're deluded.

Are either Gerrard or Lampard as technically good as Kaka, Deco, Pirlo or that Croatian guy whose name escapes me at the moment. They might be great all round players but their technique and the technique of any english player as a whole doesn't stand up to players that play on the continent.

[JKLever]

And you keep changing your story. First you were saying that our team didn't have technique or talent. Then you said they can't pass or control the ball. Now you've decidedn upon "our defenders" and general "technique".

If you seriously think that Gerrard or Lampard can't pass the ball, or control the ball as well as a player from any other country, then you're deluded.

I'm always doom-mongering about the way we play LLL - take no notice.

The bottom line is technically we aren't as good as most of the teams we play against. Gerrard and Lampard can pass of course they can.
Joe Cole is very talented.

We do have players that are techincally good. But our defenders are shit in this respect and it kills the type of game we play.

Curtis Davies do me a forking favour!

[Brass Monkey]

Are either Gerrard or Lampard as technically good as Kaka, Deco, Pirlo or that Croatian guy whose name escapes me at the moment. They might be great all round players but their technique and the technique of any english player as a whole doesn't stand up to players that play on the continent.

Oh-ho-hooo... **cough** sorry **cough**

Gerrard is calibre against anyone, f*ck whether his technique 'stands up' against Jim Bobbins. He f*cks all over some of these 'spesh' players you're on about and makes them look like f*cktards.

[JKLever]

And you keep changing your story. First you were saying that our team didn't have technique or talent. Then you said they can't pass or control the ball. Now you've decidedn upon "our defenders" and general "technique".

If you seriously think that Gerrard or Lampard can't pass the ball, or control the ball as well as a player from any other country, then you're deluded.

Are either Gerrard or Lampard as technically good as Kaka, Deco, Pirlo or that Croatian guy whose name escapes me at the moment. They might be great all round players but their technique and the technique of any english player as a whole doesn't stand up to players that play on the continent.

Agree totally. Those players have the technique to control a ball under pressure & then beat their marker with skill. Lampard is a good passer in straight lines but he doesn't possess that ability. The fact that he turns like the QE2 doesn't help in this respect either.

Oh fook, I've mentioned the 'L' word!

[JKLever]

Are either Gerrard or Lampard as technically good as Kaka, Deco, Pirlo or that Croatian guy whose name escapes me at the moment. They might be great all round players but their technique and the technique of any english player as a whole doesn't stand up to players that play on the continent.

Oh-ho-hooo... **cough** sorry **cough**

Gerrard is calibre against anyone, f*ck whether his technique 'stands up' against Jim Bobbins. He f*cks all over some of these 'spesh' players you're on about and makes them look like f*cktards.

Gerrard is a damn fine player, but he gives the ball away so much trying to play the perfect pass. He's an impatient player to me. If he's that spesh why can I count on 2 fingers the good games he's had for England?

[spangler]

I don't disagree his alround game compensates and makes him a better player, but he like all other English players can't lick their technical boots. Gerrard has other qualities that make up for it, most other English players don't.

[Brass Monkey]

Gerrard is a damn fine player, but he gives the ball away so much trying to play the perfect pass. He's an impatient player to me. If he's that spesh why can I count on 2 fingers the good games he's had for England?

That's absolutely 'ginormous' conjecture there. Back it up by outling every single game he's played for England. Minute to minute. Otherwise I could say he's played 1,000 'good games' he's played for England, whilst sniffing aerosol at halfers and wanking of a hobgoblin or two after 73.23 minutes.

[Brass Monkey]

Well, personally I think plenty of these players get glorified, such as Deco. 40% of the time he's wankhouse special fried rice, but because he's foreign and technically gifted a halo suddenly appears hovering over his head.

[JKLever]

Gerrard is a damn fine player, but he gives the ball away so much trying to play the perfect pass. He's an impatient player to me. If he's that spesh why can I count on 2 fingers the good games he's had for England?

That's absolutely 'ginormous' conjecture there. Back it up by outling every single game he's played for England. Minute to minute. Otherwise I could say he's played 1,000 'good games' he's played for England, whilst sniffing aerosol at halfers and wanking of a hobgoblin or two after 73.23 minutes.

Let me rephrase that. I'm sure he's been perfectly adequate in most of his international games. But I could count on 2 fingers the games that 'to me' he has personally stood out as outstanding in. Personally I think he's a better player than Lampard, but as I say, IMO he's way too impatient and tries to find the killer pass all the time.

All my opinion of course.

[Brass Monkey]

Let me rephrase that. I'm sure he's been perfectly adequate in most of his international games. But I could count on 2 fingers the games that 'to me' he has personally stood out as outstanding in. Personally I think he's a better player than Lampard, but as I say, IMO he's way too impatient and tries to find the killer pass all the time.

All my opinion of course.

And as mentioned, the likes of Golden Boy Deco are more than abject in a lot of their outings. Look pretty whilst they're on the ball though. All 30 seconds on the wing, with a little unimaginative dink either inside to the centre mid or behind to the wingback.

[spangler]

[quote="JKLever"][quote="Batfink Begins"]

Gerrard is a damn fine player... Personally I think he's a better player than Lampard...All my opinion of course.

No, that is 100%, bona fide, irrefutable FACT...

[Lara Lara Laughs]

And you keep changing your story. First you were saying that our team didn't have technique or talent. Then you said they can't pass or control the ball. Now you've decidedn upon "our defenders" and general "technique".

If you seriously think that Gerrard or Lampard can't pass the ball, or control the ball as well as a player from any other country, then you're deluded.

I'm always doom-mongering about the way we play LLL - take no notice.

The bottom line is technically we aren't as good as most of the teams we play against. Gerrard and Lampard can pass of course they can.
Joe Cole is very talented.

We do have players that are techincally good. But our defenders are shit in this respect and it kills the type of game we play.

Curtis Davies do me a forking favour!

Well that's fine. Instead of "Our team's crap, we've got no technique, we can't pass, we can't control and we've got no talent" you should have said "Some of our defenders can't pass and it affects out build up". Then I'd have agreed.

But even then it's an overstated observation. We've got one very good passer in defence - Rio. If you look at France in their golden period they had Desailly and Blanc. Neither of them were great passers. Then they moved Thuram to centre back and he really can pass. One passer was enough. Italy have had Cannavaro and Nesta. Cannavaro's not a great passer but Nesta can pass a bit. Holland. Jaap Stam and De Boer. De Boer was a great passer. Stam was a hoof merchant. Portugal - Couto and Carvalho (though only for a short period). Brazil in 2002 - Edmilson and Juan. Passer and wrecker.

And so on and so on. You don't need a defence full of great passers in order to play a passing game. All the defence needs to do is pass it to a midfielder. It's not difficult. Most defenders can do that. If there's pressure and the path is blocked they turn 90 degrees and pass it to another defender or back to the keeper if they really have to. The examples above show that you don't need a defence full of great passers to have a great passing side. It's to do with the mentality, not the technique.

What you seem to want is Dutch style total football. That's completely unrealistic.

Curtis Davies is class. You'll regret that.

[Brass Monkey]

No, that is 100%, bona fide, irrefutable FACT...

Shits all over him from a great height. But then, he's shits all over about 97% of the midfielders in the world.

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