West Indies v England, 3rd ODI, Bridgetown, Mar 27

JKLever wrote:I'd still prefer a regional level above country cricket where the counties have no control. N,S,W & E sides (or similar) - playing 6 FC games each where players get selected from counties to represent their region (of birth, not who they currently play for - like state of origin).

3 home, 3 away - don't care about whether its on TV or gets crowds. Just state openly that players performing in this cricket would stand a good chance of getting selected.

beamer wrote:Well, if the extra T20 competition doesn't get off the ground that's an obvious candidate to drop. Also extend the season and play T20 in Sept/Oct under lights?

"Over paid, over rated and over all too quickly: that’s our England team. It’s not as if they’re strangers to failure, having been bowled out for just 51 in a Test a few weeks ago. But, even by their lowly standards, last night’s debacle in Barbados was pretty spectacular. West Indies raced to victory in just 88 balls. England weren’t just beaten; they were embarrassed. Had this been a boxing bout, the referee would have ended it in the first round. Had it been tennis, England would have lost 6-0. Had it been swimming, England would have drowned. England have now played 17 international matches this winter; 18 if you include the Stanford game. And they’ve won just once. Even that victory was pretty hollow. It only came about because the West Indies coach, John Dyson, mis-read the Duckworth-Lewis calculation and thought his side were ahead when he called them off for bad light. It’s hard to take much pride in that, isn’t it? As a result of this sustained failure, Pitcairn Island are now breathing down the necks of England in the international rankings.

The chances of regaining the Ashes are minimal and Andy Flower is surely on the precipice of unemployment. The West Indies aren’t even that good. Until England turned up – in body, if nothing else – the West Indies hadn’t won a Test series against senior opposition (excluding Zimbabwe and Bangladesh) since 2003. It’s like being beaten up by a pygmy Perhaps the most depressing part of last night was the excuses. It’s been a long tour, apparently. England are tired. Someone had called them names and they were missing their mum. It’s all nonsense. England haven’t back-packed around the Caribbean. They haven’t swum between the islands. And several of the team – limited-overs experts apparently – only arrived a couple of weeks ago They’re just not very good. There can be no excuses. They’ve stayed in a series of luxurious hotels, travelled business class, been able to see their families and been paid a fortune. And it’s the Caribbean, remember. Perhaps the most beautiful place on earth. Have they forgotten how grim an English winter can be? The truth is that England are spoiled. They have a support staff so vast that it now encompasses batting coaches, bowling coaches, fielding coaches, physios, dieticians, masseurs, video analysts (“it turns out you should have been a plumber,” he should be saying this morning), two lion tamers and a woman who makes balloon animals.

OK, I made the last two up, but you get the point. From an early age the players are pampered, preened and indulged. They gain reward before achievement; sponsorship before success. They are sent warm-weather training. They are taught the importance of rest. And they are vastly, ridiculously over paid. For an England player earning less than £400,000 a year should be looking for a new agent. It’s no use just blaming the players. We can all suggest a few changes in the side, but the grim truth is that the team who represented England last night, are not a million miles from the best XI. The don’t lack talent. They lack backbone. No, it’s the culture of English cricket that must change. We need to stop rewarding failure. Stop lauding mediocrity. And stop hiding behind excuses. We shouldn’t be surprised, though. The rot starts at the top. Quite how Hugh Morris, the managing director of England cricket, keeps his job is a mystery. He’s meant to be responsible for the fortunes of the national team. Yet despite the sacking of the previous coach, Peter Moores (whose appointment he oversaw), the previous captain, Kevin Pietersen (whose appointment he oversaw) and a winless record that stretches back to the dawn of time, he somehow survives. Now he’s employed a team of head-hunters to help find the next England coach (or ‘team director’ as they call it).

Which begs the question: if a team of head-hunters know better than him who should be coach, why aren’t they running English cricket? The truth is that Morris wants a buffer. He knows that if and when the next coach fails, Morris can hide behind the fact that the head-hunters got it wrong. He wants all the trappings of high office without any of the responsibility. He has to go. Not just because he’s failed, but to show the players –that feeble band of millionaires – that there is accountability in English cricket. And then there’s the players. I hope the players went out in Barbados last night. I hope they mixed with the England supporters – most of whom will have paid many thousands of pounds for that tosh - and felt the hurt they had inflicted. I hope they apologised. Young players then need harder apprenticeships. Academies are fine, but it’s not technique that England are lacking. It’s guts. And fight. And desire. So don’t send youngsters to Australia in the winter; send them to work in factories and offices. Let them know their alternatives. Let them see how lucky they are."

beamer wrote:Well, if the extra T20 competition doesn't get off the ground that's an obvious candidate to drop. Also extend the season and play T20 in Sept/Oct under lights?

The chances of regaining the Ashes are minimal and Andy Flower is surely on the precipice of unemployment. The West Indies aren’t even that good. Until England turned up – in body, if nothing else – the West Indies hadn’t won a Test series against senior opposition (excluding Zimbabwe and Bangladesh) since 2003. It’s like being beaten up by a pygmy

Aberforth wrote:

The West Indies aren’t even that good.

Yet the English eye (like Jonathan's Swift's Laputan's) is firmly fixed on the Ashes as it has been continually since 2005 AD. The level of condescension is laughable actually and it will be more so if WI stuff England in the remaining 2 matches of the series.

Rob I wrote:

Aberforth wrote:

The West Indies aren’t even that good.

No, they aren't. India are good. SA are good. Australia are getting good again.

Yet the English eye (like Jonathan's Swift's Laputan's) is firmly fixed on the Ashes as it has been continually since 2005 AD. The level of condescension is laughable actually and it will be more so if WI stuff England in the remaining 2 matches of the series.

I would agree, and the rot set in late in 2005 when England rolled up to Pakistan unprepared and carrying injuries to several key players. Feltch failed to realise that the 2003-5 team could not continue, and yet kept on hoping for SiJo to get well and on-form Fred and on-form Harmi to return, instead of doing the correct thing and rebuilding.

However, I'm still expecting England to duff up WI in the tests England, before falling to Australia again.