Re: The Wimbledon Thread - anyone for tennis?

[tricycle]

Yeah, the way he finished 2009, it seemed that he'd be the main rival to Nadal and Federer. Then he did his wrist.

Not quite the same level, but Robin Soderling's another who looked to be in the ascendancy till illness took over.

[beamer]

Yeah, Sodders is the only player to beat Rafa at Roland Garros isn't he? Got up to 4 or 5 in the rankings but hasn't managed to fully recover from glandular fever it seems.

Del Potro did look likely to jump the queue in the days when it was Federer-Nadal then Djokovic-Murray a level behind. He's still remarkably young when you consider he's won a Slam then had a considerable time out of the game afterwards.

[Chivalry Augustus]

He is young but I'm not sure his body is. He'll miss a lot more tennis through injury and would be glad if he could win another slam in his whole career, I reckon. It's a shame because at his best + with those missed years added on, he could have been up there dining with the elite. As it is, he'll lose this match - albeit to the probable winner of the tournament - and probably be injured again before the next slam.

Soderling's a decent player but he showed no guts at all whenever he reached a major final. Just rolled over and died. Talented, but no heart. I remember watching all five sets of the JMDP - Federer final. At the time I didn't know anything about JMDP, but within that match I was won over by the sheer heart of the guy. He left nothing out on that court come the end. Federer was beaten by a guy who just kept slugging it out. It was one of the best finals I've ever seen, as much because it was expected to be a walkover as anything.

JMDP's doing the same now. He'll probably lose to a player at his absolute peak, but JMDP ain't going to roll over and die.

[PeterCS]

Never ceases to amaze how a small detail can have a huge significance. (Well, maybe not so amazing, given human psychology under strain ...)

Del Potro missed an open court, with Djok on the floor, with an easy smash in the third set tiebreak. (The smash is the weakest aspect of his game - perhaps odd for a very tall man.) After that, he lost four points in a row, the set ... and probably the match.

[PeterCS]

Having said which, both players have played their balls off.

The Argentinian has been specially heroic, with half an eye permanently on that there knee. Has been fairly nifty round the court though - but you see his trepidation, and his inability to chase a few important points as fast as he otherwise would. Meaning he gets a racket on it, but not convincingly.

[tricycle]

He is young but I'm not sure his body is. He'll miss a lot more tennis through injury and would be glad if he could win another slam in his whole career, I reckon. It's a shame because at his best + with those missed years added on, he could have been up there dining with the elite. As it is, he'll lose this match - albeit to the probable winner of the tournament - and probably be injured again before the next slam.

Soderling's a decent player but he showed no guts at all whenever he reached a major final. Just rolled over and died. Talented, but no heart. I remember watching all five sets of the JMDP - Federer final. At the time I didn't know anything about JMDP, but within that match I was won over by the sheer heart of the guy. He left nothing out on that court come the end. Federer was beaten by a guy who just kept slugging it out. It was one of the best finals I've ever seen, as much because it was expected to be a walkover as anything.

JMDP's doing the same now. He'll probably lose to a player at his absolute peak, but JMDP ain't going to roll over and die.

Yeah, I can see what you mean about Soderling crumbling in a major final, but he was never as talented as Del Potro. Think it was just prior to the 08 US Open when the CNN were raving about Del Potro winning four or so tournaments on the trot (mostly 250 rankings) and made him one of the outsiders (in a time where it was Federer and Nadal only), albeit rather prematurely. So his quality was apparent early.

Yeah, Sodders is the only player to beat Rafa at Roland Garros isn't he? Got up to 4 or 5 in the rankings but hasn't managed to fully recover from glandular fever it seems.

Del Potro did look likely to jump the queue in the days when it was Federer-Nadal then Djokovic-Murray a level behind. He's still remarkably young when you consider he's won a Slam then had a considerable time out of the game afterwards.

Glandular fever? Bad luck.

[tricycle]

Brilliant comeback, going into a fifth set

[PeterCS]

Bloody ridiculous combat. Bloody fantastic tennis.

Del Potro has a heart like a tiger.

Kudos to Djok too, amazing fighting qualities and calm amid the storm.

I would take the Seb to win it at the end, on energy. He's survived these and longer before. Surely Del P can't hang on and hammer back much longer?

[PeterCS]

Lisicki showing a palpable absence of spunk so far. Seems perhaps overawed, definitely disorientated to meet someone as determined and clever with the returns as herself.

Bartoli the cat that got the cream.

6-1!

[Red]

Must say that the equal prizemoney business is a disgrace.

Sabine only started playing some half decent tennis when she faced her first match point.

Hardly money's worth for the big crowd.

[tricycle]

It will be a freaking disgrace if someone like Bartoli won Wimbledon.

The name was etched on the plate as soon as this was written.

[PeterCS]

ffs, another Women's Singles Finals crack-up.

And when you think back 24 hours to Dell Poe-troe vee Djoe-kovich - or even Murray vee Djankervits - it's this sort of thing that brings women's tennis into disrepute. They just can't handle it. Well, the poor dears.

Yes, we all love you Sa-bean. Have no fears on that score. But you know what? We all feel like sending you the invoices for that wasted hour of our lives that won't come again. Not to mention the cream of Britain's finest paying all their precious British pounds to see this complete fiasco. Well, I'm sorry too. Don't come back in a hurry, Sa-bean. That's all we say. Don't let the door hit your precious little ass on the way to the bank.


You can tell that's what Johnny MacE was REALLY thinking as he expressed his sympathy through clenched teeth.


Seriously though - if Miss Licky thinks she can stay on Monkehh's smashlist after that sort of collapse, she can think again.

He doesn't just take any loser off the street, you know.

Well, only when he's feeling a bit pissed off.

[lardbucket]

He might find a use for her once she's pregnant.

[PeterCS]

He can do that too. He's a multi-tasker.

[beamer]

Anyone can fall apart in their first major final, and it's unfair to compare with the top men who have been competing at the highest level for years.

The current women's game does seem to be a mixture of streaky hitters who can be equally brilliant or awful, and more skilful players who tend to be out-powered. Sooner or later someone of the new generation has to find some consistency.

[taipan]

ffs, another Women's Singles Finals crack-up.

And when you think back 24 hours to Dell Poe-troe vee Djoe-kovich - or even Murray vee Djankervits - it's this sort of thing that brings women's tennis into disrepute. They just can't handle it. Well, the poor dears.

Yes, we all love you Sa-bean. Have no fears on that score. But you know what? We all feel like sending you the invoices for that wasted hour of our lives that won't come again. Not to mention the cream of Britain's finest paying all their precious British pounds to see this complete fiasco. Well, I'm sorry too. Don't come back in a hurry, Sa-bean. That's all we say. Don't let the door hit your precious little ass on the way to the bank.


You can tell that's what Johnny MacE was REALLY thinking as he expressed his sympathy through clenched teeth.


Seriously though - if Miss Licky thinks she can stay on Monkehh's smashlist after that sort of collapse, she can think again.

He doesn't just take any loser off the street, you know.

Well, only when he's feeling a bit pissed off.

Bit sexist.

[taipan]

Must say that the equal prizemoney business is a disgrace.

Sabine only started playing some half decent tennis when she faced her first match point.

Hardly money's worth for the big crowd.

Of course she got a bye into the final and didn't have to play anyone of note.

[PeterCS]

But actually, that IS almost true of Bartoli. The Belgian (Flipkens) also wilted in the semi. Maybe Bartoli has some sort of evil eye, like Spassky had against Fischer.

In any case, she came up with the goods. They mostly had only to be goods, not greats, in the semi and final. That's the pity of it.

[PeterCS]

ffs, another Women's Singles Finals crack-up.

And when you think back 24 hours to Dell Poe-troe vee Djoe-kovich - or even Murray vee Djankervits - it's this sort of thing that brings women's tennis into disrepute. They just can't handle it. Well, the poor dears.

Yes, we all love you Sa-bean. Have no fears on that score. But you know what? We all feel like sending you the invoices for that wasted hour of our lives that won't come again. Not to mention the cream of Britain's finest paying all their precious British pounds to see this complete fiasco. Well, I'm sorry too. Don't come back in a hurry, Sa-bean. That's all we say. Don't let the door hit your precious little ass on the way to the bank.


You can tell that's what Johnny MacE was REALLY thinking as he expressed his sympathy through clenched teeth.


Seriously though - if Miss Licky thinks she can stay on Monkehh's smashlist after that sort of collapse, she can think again.

He doesn't just take any loser off the street, you know.

Well, only when he's feeling a bit pissed off.

Bit sexist.

Really??

[taipan]

ffs, another Women's Singles Finals crack-up.

And when you think back 24 hours to Dell Poe-troe vee Djoe-kovich - or even Murray vee Djankervits - it's this sort of thing that brings women's tennis into disrepute. They just can't handle it. Well, the poor dears.

Yes, we all love you Sa-bean. Have no fears on that score. But you know what? We all feel like sending you the invoices for that wasted hour of our lives that won't come again. Not to mention the cream of Britain's finest paying all their precious British pounds to see this complete fiasco. Well, I'm sorry too. Don't come back in a hurry, Sa-bean. That's all we say. Don't let the door hit your precious little ass on the way to the bank.


You can tell that's what Johnny MacE was REALLY thinking as he expressed his sympathy through clenched teeth.


Seriously though - if Miss Licky thinks she can stay on Monkehh's smashlist after that sort of collapse, she can think again.

He doesn't just take any loser off the street, you know.

Well, only when he's feeling a bit pissed off.

Bit sexist.

Really??

Yes.

[beamer]

I think women's tennis is suffering in part due to a real resurgence in the men's game as a spectacle.

Obviously physical differences mean the top men will always have a lot more power. But in the 90s, men's tennis had something of an identity crisis, particularly on grass - the rally was almost a thing of the past, it had just become a big servers' firing range, Sampras won 7 titles of which barely 1 or 2 were contests. There was a tedious inevitability about his victories. It wasn't even the classic serve-volley tennis of the likes of Becker and Edberg, it had moved on a level to something with little aesthetic appeal. Agassi proved that you can win from the baseline on grass, but his victory, for a while at least, proved a one-off.

Meanwhile the women's game was something of an antidote to this, it was something still recognisable as tennis, and from the 90s through to around the turn of the millennium it arguably delivered more entertainment pound-for-pound.

Then something changed, they slowed down the balls and courts and the likes of Federer took over with an altogether more watchable brand of tennis. The women's game again became a poor relation, not helped by the lack of consistent challengers to the Williams sisters. And it just happened to coincide with equal prize money - but not, of course, equal status in terms of 5-set matches. There have been some quality matches this week but the final will be used as ammunition for the detractors. It's perhaps ironic that while women's sport in general is getting increasing profile, the tennis is having something of a tough time image-wise.

[PeterCS]

Good post.

(Unironic comment.)

[taipan]

I think women's tennis is suffering in part due to a real resurgence in the men's game as a spectacle.

Obviously physical differences mean the top men will always have a lot more power. But in the 90s, men's tennis had something of an identity crisis, particularly on grass - the rally was almost a thing of the past, it had just become a big servers' firing range, Sampras won 7 titles of which barely 1 or 2 were contests. There was a tedious inevitability about his victories. It wasn't even the classic serve-volley tennis of the likes of Becker and Edberg, it had moved on a level to something with little aesthetic appeal. Agassi proved that you can win from the baseline on grass, but his victory, for a while at least, proved a one-off.

Meanwhile the women's game was something of an antidote to this, it was something still recognisable as tennis, and from the 90s through to around the turn of the millennium it arguably delivered more entertainment pound-for-pound.

Then something changed, they slowed down the balls and courts and the likes of Federer took over with an altogether more watchable brand of tennis. The women's game again became a poor relation, not helped by the lack of consistent challengers to the Williams sisters. And it just happened to coincide with equal prize money - but not, of course, equal status in terms of 5-set matches. There have been some quality matches this week but the final will be used as ammunition for the detractors. It's perhaps ironic that while women's sport in general is getting increasing profile, the tennis is having something of a tough time image-wise.

Yep, I have always had a problem with the equal money with different playing conditions.

We also tend to forget that many men's finals have been non events.

[beamer]

Yeah, we've been in a golden age of Federer/Nadal/Djokovic/Murray epics, and one or two others getting in on the act on occasions. When this generation retire or decline we will probably be back to either a one player dominance or nobody really that good era.

[taipan]

We forget that Connors lost 2,2 and 2, and 1,1 and 2.

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