Re: The UK General Election Thread (II)

[doremi]

Hung parliament? Thought that was our speciality...

[doremi]

Was out travelling most of last 3 days, so just seen the news. I'm guessing merlo and AD are reasonably happy with how things turned up...

[JKLever]

Depends, no one has a clue who will be in power for a few days.

[Allan D]

Except I voted tactically but the MP I was trying to remove doubled his majority! Also Labour regained the local council in a landslide and far too much dead wood got re-elected - Ed Balls, Bercow, Glenda Jackson inter alii so it was modified rapture. Serves me right for paying too much attention to the polls as well as the previous election results.

Not really a clean result and Mad Broon remains ensconced in Downing Street and, judging by his performance today, it may take weeks to remove him. Nothing left for it but to settle down with a hot chocolate and a cafe beurre and watch Downfall.

[Basil]

I suspect Clegg is of the opinion that the Tories are the only game in town. Labour + Lib Dems cannot command a majority - they would surely be neaten in a confidence vote sooner rather than later - the Tories could then accuse both of incompetence and romp home in a second election.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Lib Dems settled for something less than a full-blown coalition and stay on the opposition benches so that they are not readilly associated too closely with the Tories.

[Allan D]

Gordon - The Movie:

[Basil]

Except I voted tactically but the MP I was trying to remove doubled his majority! Also Labour regained the local council in a landslide and far too much dead wood got re-elected - Ed Balls, Bercow, Glenda Jackson inter alii so it was modified rapture. Serves me right for paying too much attention to the polls as well as the previous election results.

Not really a clean result and Mad Broon remains ensconced in Downing Street and, judging by his performance today, it may take weeks to remove him. Nothing left for it but to settle down with a hot chocolate and a cafe beurre and watch Downfall.

Brown is fulfilling his constitutional responsibility by staying on as PM until a new government takes shape.

[Allan D]

Or until someone hands him a shot of whisky and a revolver.

[Gary 111]

I think if there was another election in the near future the Labour Party with a leader other than Brown could easily overtake the Conservatives again. It is clear that there is not much appetite for many of the Tory's 1980s style policies. Despite Brown's unpopularity and the Liberals splitting the Labour vote the Conservatives were still nowhere near an overall majority.

[Merlin]

I think if there was another election in the near future the Labour Party with a leader other than Brown could easily overtake the Conservatives again. It is clear that there is not much appetite for many of the Tory's 1980s style policies. Despite Brown's unpopularity and the Liberals splitting the Labour vote the Conservatives were still nowhere near an overall majority.

Eh?!
2 million more votes than Labour.
96 seats gained.
Swings between 4 to 11 % from Labour to Tory.
Largest number of seats acquired (306) - beating Thatcher's and Blair's landslides ...

Jesus, why are people still banging on about the '80's?
The 80's was almost 30 years ago Gazza .... time you re-set your memory chip mate!
Quite a lot of people have moved on since then - and indeed a new generation (who probably first voted for the Blair charisma back in '97) have grown through the devastation NuLabour caused; sleaze that made Major's lot look like amateurs; sending poorly equipped troops to die in countries they had no legal right to invade and financal mismanagement on a mammoth scale to almost rival that of Greece.
All courtesy of this government and achieved over 13 long years .....do you wonder just why those figures I quoted above were finally realized this election?

But hey, you don't have to take my word for it, just check out the polls details in tomorrows rags!

[Gary 111]

I think if there was another election in the near future the Labour Party with a leader other than Brown could easily overtake the Conservatives again. It is clear that there is not much appetite for many of the Tory's 1980s style policies. Despite Brown's unpopularity and the Liberals splitting the Labour vote the Conservatives were still nowhere near an overall majority.

Eh?!
2 million more votes than Labour.
96 seats gained.
Swings between 4 to 11 % from Labour to Tory.
Largest number of seats acquired (306) - beating Thatcher's and Blair's landslides ...

Nice attempt at spin Merlin. I remember that you were used by England's batsmen a few years ago to practice for batting against Shane Warne.

Thatcher and Blair actually won their elections though. I think you will find that Cameron did not, that's why he's knocking on Nick Clegg's door begging for his support.

[Merlin]

Yep ... and Brown's holed up in his bunker hoping for a miracle!!
Amazing how cock-ups are now termed as "spin" ... NuLabours one policy that really worked for them for 13 years!

What I find interesting is why keep on banging on about the '80's?!
I don't hear any belly aching about the last 13 years ... only the wishful thinking that "with a leader other than Brown could easily overtake the Conservatives again" .....!

That's the trouble with NuLabour spin and doctrine .... blame one guy for the entire party's cock ups and sleaze over the past 13 years! Meanwhile Tone reaps (or is that rapes) the free market at $500K a pop for a lecture on how he did it all "his" way! And to think Milliband will most probably replace Brown this week .... ! Oh joy!

[Allan D]

Thatcher and Blair actually won their elections though. I think you will find that Cameron did not, that's why he's knocking on Nick Clegg's door begging for his support.

Up to a point, Lord Copper:

2005 General Election:

Labour: 35.3%

Cons: 32.3%

Lib Dems: 22.1%

Labour overall majority of 66


2010 General Election

Cons: 36.1%

Labour: 29.0%

Lib Dems: 23.0%

Cons short of overall majority by 20 seats.

Go figure.

[Merlin]

You beat me to it AD !

But a word of caution, those are facts that might just be be regarded as "spin" !

[Gary 111]

Thatcher and Blair actually won their elections though. I think you will find that Cameron did not, that's why he's knocking on Nick Clegg's door begging for his support.

Up to a point, Lord Copper:

2005 General Election:

Labour: 35.3%

Cons: 32.3%

Lib Dems: 22.1%

Labour overall majority of 66


2010 General Election

Cons: 36.1%

Labour: 29.0%

Lib Dems: 23.0%

Cons short of overall majority by 20 seats.

Go figure.

In that case the Tories will welcome the Lib Dems proposed voting reforms.....!

[Merlin]

In that case the Tories will welcome the Lib Dems proposed voting reforms.....!

Won't happen.
You heard it here first.

[Bradman]

You know the Queen could get dragged into this. She's just not a figurehead. And she did stick her beak into the Suez crisis and the Douglas-Home affair.

[lardbucket]

You know the Queen could get dragged into this

still in coalition negotiations with Cameron at this stage

[Allan D]

You know the Queen could get dragged into this. She's just not a figurehead. And she did stick her beak into the Suez crisis and the Douglas-Home affair.

Errr...how? Her only intervention during the Suez Crisis was to cancel the Royal Variety Performance since she thought it would be inappropriate to attend a variety show while British forces were in action. The Douglas-Home Affair? Did he not get picked to go to South Africa either?

If you mean when he was appointed Prime Minister in succession to Harold Macmillan in 1963, as I have pointed out, at length, in this thread before both the Queen and Home acted perfectly properly throughout, the Queen by insisting on being verbally "advised" by Macmillan to send for Home, Home by asking for a commission to form a government rather than by accepting appointment as PM straight away.

Macmillan's role in rigging the consultation processes of the Conservative Party in favour of Home and against Butler from his hospital bed is rather more dubious. The Queen later expressed relief that the Conservatives had adopted a formal leadership election procedure by secret ballot in 1965. The only way HM could become involved is if there is complete constitutional deadlock which is highly unlikely. Her motto, generally however, to misquote Alistair Campbell, is:

We don't do politics

[Merlin]

Brad's - other than the fact that the leader of a very poor 3rd placed party is being wooed for his party's support in forming a government - what's the crisis ?!

[Basil]

Just in case it had escaped anyone's attention, the economy is in a dire mess, and is likely to get worse. Establishing a government which the financial markets will have confidence in and will tackle these huge problems is of paramount importance.

I thought Cameron showed huge statesmanship in his speech yesterday - and as a Lib Dem voter, that was hard for me to type! A coalition or some sort of agreement between Cameron and Clegg to sustain a government for three or four years with a sensible programme of economic and constitutional reform is the way to go.

[Merlin]

The country'sfinances WILL (not is likely to) get worse. Fact.

Providing the demands from the LibDems aren't too ambitious and over demanding, this deal can work.
Clegg has to realize that, whilst he might be lauded as the "king maker", his party did, when all's said and done, come a remote third - as such, he too should show strong statesmanship as Cameron did, and come to an amicable agreement to take a strong Tory led government forward to sort out this mess. it will bode well for the LibDems 4 years down the road if it works ... and hopefully kick the Socialists into the wilderness happily thereafter.

However, Cameron and the Tory hardliners won't tolerate any excessive demands and as such, I'd be very wary of Clegg's intentions until such time as any deal is struck.

If, as seems from his TV performances, Clegg's priority is to put the "Party First" - then forget about a deal with the Tories ....I then see Cameron showing him the door and allowing him to deal with Brown - contrary to Clegg's previous assertions - whilst the Tories wait for the inevitable chaotic collapse by year end and another election.

It's not all gloom and doom providing the LibDems recognize the need to cooperate and thereafter accept a sensible agreement.

[Growler]

I think they'll thrash out a deal in time, since I think Clegg realises that the electorate won't easily forgive his party if they sustain Labour in power after the kicking they've just had.

I'm minded to agree with Merlin that our finances will get worse for a time. Labour were right - up to a point - when they said that government spending can play a part in getting the economy out of recession. Trouble was, they insisted on spending on idiot projects like ID cards & biometric passports costing a fortune and doing bugger all to protect us from terrorists as was claimed.

The government should spend - but on things which will 1. create real jobs, 2. help the environment and 3. be of benefit to the whole country when times get better. There are three things off the top of my head

First - push ahead with the HS2 rail link between London & Scotland. That project alone will create thousands of skilled jobs in construction, electrical engineering, and signalling engineering - plus building the new trains required to run on said lines. Even if HS2 was authorised tomorrow, planning, surveying and land purchase means it would be a year or more before a sod is cut ... ample time to train the workforce needed. Now that really is investment in the true sense of the word ... over 30 yeras or more, the money will come back to the government many times over.

Second - bite the bullet over energy supplies, and get on with building the dozen or so modern nuclear power stations so we're no longer dependant on Middle Eastern oil or Russian gas to generate electricity. Although the build would be government funded, the operation would best be in the hands of a private company. Build outlay is recovered by 1. tendering for operating licences and 2. an annual "rent" of the facility which will essentially still be government owned. Again, more real, skilled jobs for the good of the nation.

Third - grants to local councils to 1. Repair the potholes in so many roads, and to resurface the worst of them, and 2. Repair and modernise the council housing stock. Imagine the number of small independant builders, plumbers and electricians who'd take on an apprentice if they had ongoing contracts to do up houses which become empty on the death of a tenant. The knock on in the economy works its way to kitchen, bathroom fitting and window manufacturers.

More people in work paying tax rather than getting benefits, fewer young men with no hope for the future, and a country 10 years from now with decent infrastructure and ready to take advantage of the global recovery.

[Hass]

Put Cable as 2nd in command to Osborne at the Treasury and make Clegg Home Secretary.

The only sticking point with making Clegg Home Secretary is that the Home Office looks after immigration.

I suppose they could get around that by taking that responsibility away from the Home Secretary and giving it to a newly created Minister for Immigration.

[Basil]

I'll be surprised if the Lib Dems accept a full-blown coalition, but if they did, how about:

Cable: Chief Secretary to the Treasury
Clegg: Leader of the House
Paddy Ashdown: Leader of the House of Lords
Ming Campbell: Secretary of State for Scotland

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