Re: Australia v England, 2nd ODI, Brisbane, 17 January, 2014

by Henry Wed 15 Jan 2014, 21:08

Surely the ultimate humiliation for a bowling coach is to have one of the young bowlers under your care sent home because he is un-selectable. It's ridiculous the amount of young English fast bowlers who have lost confidence, rhythm and pace over the last 5-6 years, having had all of those attributes BEFORE they joined the England setup.

by holcs Wed 15 Jan 2014, 21:12

Sounds like he has developed the yips, it's psychological! Talk about screwing someone up!

You've developed a bowler to the point he is scared witless/incapable of releasing the damn thing!

by G.Wood Wed 15 Jan 2014, 21:15

How often did he actually hit the stumps? Was it that many that you couldn't just say "fark it, we'll wear the noballs" and let him go back to the way he bowled before.

A Finn + occassional no-balls would have to better than

other nations don't seem to have problems playing bowlers with no-ball problems. eg Sri Lanka. Pakistan, WIndies etc

by Henry Wed 15 Jan 2014, 21:20

G.Wood wrote:How often did he actually hit the stumps? Was that many that you couldn't just say "fark it, we'll wear the noballs" and let him go back to the wear he bowled before.

A Finn + occassional no-balls would have to better than

other nations don't seem to have problems playing bowlers with no-ball problems. eg Sri Lanka. Pakistan, WIndies etc

About once every three overs. A lot of bowlers overstep the front line more often than that.

by skully Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:17

I feel sorry for Finn. He was a hard working integral part of the Poms thrashing of us in 10/11.

by lardbucket Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:20

He's been Fergied ... though he never had a match quite like Fergie's 72 sensation.

by Henry Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:21

Six pages for a jamodi that hasn't even started, eh? Strange times.

by lardbucket Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:22

It has wandered slightly off track!

by skully Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:22

lardbucket wrote:He's been Fergied ... though he never had a match quite like Fergie's 72 sensation.

Aye, Massie's demise was a sad thing to follow at the time.

by lardbucket Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:24

It all happened very quickly in the course of the 1973 Windies tour. Apparently the pitches were such shirtfronts, with no movement whatsoever, that he started to bang the ball in ... then never retrieved his earlier action and the swing that came with it. He barely made the WA team after returning from that tour.

by LeFromage Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:33

beamer wrote:
Dello wrote:Poor guy, he's been absolutely ruined. Wonder if he'll ever recover.
The entire bowling coaching staff should be sacked for this. In fact, maybe it's time to forget bowling technical coaching and just concentrate on the psychology of it and say to them, go out and bowl with your natural action. Preferably as fast as you're able to.

Finn could come back stronger like Anderson did, or he could be out of the game completely in a couple of years. Perhaps we should blame Graeme Smith who was apparently the first to complain about him running into the stumps. Is he not satisfied with finishing off an England captain every four years or so?

Anderson didn't absolutely fall to pieces, though. Cooley remodelled his action and he lost some consistency. But he never forgot how to bowl to the extent that he couldn't land the ball on the pitch any longer.

Finn has been totally dismantled - from merely having a small no-ball problem.

by LeFromage Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:35

G.Wood wrote:How often did he actually hit the stumps? Was it that many that you couldn't just say "fark it, we'll wear the noballs" and let him go back to the way he bowled before.

A Finn + occassional no-balls would have to better than

other nations don't seem to have problems playing bowlers with no-ball problems. eg Sri Lanka. Pakistan, WIndies etc

I think Ben Stokes knocked the bails off four or five times in one of the Ashes Tests. Finn was no worse than that, really.

by PeterCS Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:35

Gus Fraser will sort him out.

Just ask Merlo.

by Henry Wed 15 Jan 2014, 22:36

Dello wrote:
beamer wrote:
Dello wrote:Poor guy, he's been absolutely ruined. Wonder if he'll ever recover.
The entire bowling coaching staff should be sacked for this. In fact, maybe it's time to forget bowling technical coaching and just concentrate on the psychology of it and say to them, go out and bowl with your natural action. Preferably as fast as you're able to.

Finn could come back stronger like Anderson did, or he could be out of the game completely in a couple of years. Perhaps we should blame Graeme Smith who was apparently the first to complain about him running into the stumps. Is he not satisfied with finishing off an England captain every four years or so?

Anderson didn't absolutely fall to pieces, though. Cooley remodelled his action and he lost some consistency. But he never forgot how to bowl to the extent that he couldn't land the ball on the pitch any longer.

Finn has been totally dismantled - from merely having a small no-ball problem.

Anderson has said that he basically gave up on England's coaches, returned to Lancashire, and reminded himself of how to bowl with his original, natural action. I think England's army of career destroyers have left him pretty much alone ever since.

by LeFromage Wed 15 Jan 2014, 23:13

Henry wrote:
Dello wrote:
beamer wrote:
Dello wrote:Poor guy, he's been absolutely ruined. Wonder if he'll ever recover.
The entire bowling coaching staff should be sacked for this. In fact, maybe it's time to forget bowling technical coaching and just concentrate on the psychology of it and say to them, go out and bowl with your natural action. Preferably as fast as you're able to.

Finn could come back stronger like Anderson did, or he could be out of the game completely in a couple of years. Perhaps we should blame Graeme Smith who was apparently the first to complain about him running into the stumps. Is he not satisfied with finishing off an England captain every four years or so?

Anderson didn't absolutely fall to pieces, though. Cooley remodelled his action and he lost some consistency. But he never forgot how to bowl to the extent that he couldn't land the ball on the pitch any longer.

Finn has been totally dismantled - from merely having a small no-ball problem.

Anderson has said that he basically gave up on England's coaches, returned to Lancashire, and reminded himself of how to bowl with his original, natural action. I think England's army of career destroyers have left him pretty much alone ever since.

Anderson was tampered with in a different era, where England's bowling coaches were obsessed with biomechanics and attempted to remodel everyone who crossed their path to fit one "ideal", with consequences ranging from ineffective (Harmison), to detrimental (Anderson), to devastating (Plunkett).

I don't think David Saker is that kind of coach. He seems to be more of a tactical sounding post than anything else.

Regardless, it's all f*cked up.

by skully Wed 15 Jan 2014, 23:37

Henry wrote:Anderson has said that he basically gave up on England's coaches, returned to Lancashire, and reminded himself of how to bowl with his original, natural action. I think England's army of career destroyers have left him pretty much alone ever since.

This is a good point. I think the same thing applied to Midge. Lillee and McSofty concentrated more on strengthening key bowling muscles (his core) than tinkering with his action (as previous coaches, including Cooley, did) and let him bowl with his natural style. Look at the difference letting him bowl with freedom and a clear head has made.

by Red Thu 16 Jan 2014, 02:46

Watson has been replaced by Dan Christian for the forthcoming ODIs.

by horace Thu 16 Jan 2014, 02:53

hmmn...dropped or 'rested'?

by skully Thu 16 Jan 2014, 05:47

He felt a pain in his chest.

by embee Thu 16 Jan 2014, 06:16

The vacuum where a heart should be?

by embee Thu 16 Jan 2014, 06:16

or was the wax too hot?

by Nath Thu 16 Jan 2014, 06:51

Red wrote:Watson has been replaced by Dan Christian for the forthcoming ODIs.

by skully Thu 16 Jan 2014, 09:00

embee wrote:The vacuum where a heart should be?

Perzackerly.

by skully Fri 17 Jan 2014, 03:08

Eng win the toss and bat.

Australia 1 Aaron Finch, 2 David Warner, 3 Shaun Marsh, 4 Michael Clarke, 5 George Bailey, 6 Glenn Maxwell, 7 Brad Haddin, 8 James Faulkner, 9 Mitchell Johnson, 10 Nathan Coulter-Nile, 11 Clint McKay.

England 1 Alastair Cook, 2 Ian Bell, 3 Joe Root, 4 Gary Ballance, 5 Eoin Morgan, 6 Ravi Bopara, 7 Jos Buttler, 8 Ben Stokes, 9 Tim Bresnan, 10 Chris Jordan, 11 Boyd Rankin.

Unchanged Pom side - surprising. columbo

by Anthony_Gonzales Fri 17 Jan 2014, 03:20

England batting...so I continue with watching Breaking Bad. A million times more interesting Smile

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